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hat-trick
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OP
hat-trick
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,521 |
Yeah if you go back towards the top..Harry was showing this great concern for a club he is not involved with..Kind of callin them out..The cheatin stuff just kind of followed..
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hat-trick
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hat-trick
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Posts: 1,521 |
What does Club recruiting have to do with H.S.Championships?
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Quote:
You guys don't know how happy you make me to be coaching a Classic team at one of the smaller clubs, where all I have to worry about is whether my players are developing both individually and as a team, and whether they're getting something positive out of the experience--not always about who is "best" and who wins the most championships, as if that were always truly a measure of how much players have progressed as a result of being a part of the club.
Yes, CESA has the advantage of being an established winner, and players who want to be recognized want to play for an established winner--which leads to a larger and more selective player pool, which helps to perpetuate the winning, which increases the reputation, et cetera, and so on, ad nauseum. It does leave the question of whether the winning is a result of the player pool, or whether the player pool is a result of the winning. Chicken or egg.
Could CESA win as many championships if good players from other areas didn't travel there based on reputation? Could CUFC win more championships if more of those players came there rather than CESA? Could a thousand monkeys with a thousand typewriters working for a thousand years eventually reproduce the combined works of Shakespeare?
A better question might be, is my child/young adult having a positive experience at his/her soccer club, and is he/she gaining the skills, confidence, and motivation to succeed at his/her goals?
If the answer is yes...it really doesn't matter what the "other" guy is doing.
coach in this case i think you have the player pool because you win.on the premier level anyway.
players that want to play in college and parents that want some help,need to be playing in front of the college coaches.to do that you need to be playing on a team and club that does that for you.if a club or team does not win then i think the player pool is not there.
sorry if i can not wait for your reply.i have to work for a change.
P.S. this is just for the premier level.i know it may be different within a club on the classic level.
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Joined: Apr 2004
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Chass, but, if the answer is no, then it matters greatly what the "other" guy is doing.
Someone always has to get the ball rolling in this kind of debate. On this particular thread it was what has been labeled as the concern trolling with the conclusion of the state cup and the results of the championships.
Before the state cup it was someone discussing the gap closing, when the comparison was made with the number of teams in the final 4.
As in many threads, there are several spin off discussions embedded in this one, many of which can be termed, oh yeah, well what about.....which follows the neener neener statement of being childish. Go figure.
This ODP recruiting thing was several years ago, so not really relevant to the discussion of the number of state cup championships for this year.
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hard headedQuote:
No- you did with your typical cesa is not doing anything illegal but they cheat post.
I choose my words very carefully. That some choose to see things in them that aren't there is not my problem. Your post is a good example. I have repeatedly said that I am unaware of "illegal" conduct on the part of CESA. I have said that I don't like some of the legal conduct by CESA. Reading into that an accusation of cheating is a bit strange.
My frustration with this whole issue, begun by harry, is that people are comparing apples and tangerines. CUFC does not aspire to be like CESA. The CUFC coaches and DOC's do not get together and formulate plans as to how each age group is going to win state cup. The administration does not demand explanations and corrective plans when an age group fails to win state cup. Coaches are not required to keep scouting/recruiting books on the other teams in the state in their age group. Teams don't bring in out of state players for state cup, right at roster freeze, displacing kids who have been on the team all season.
As I said in a previous post, my perception is that CESA's institutional priority at the select level is winning state championships - and everything works backwards from that.
As I have also said, and will say again - none of the above is illegal and to make it clear for you - it is not cheating. I assume that the CESA family understands and approves of the way the club operates and of its priorities. At least I would hope that's the case.
Clearly CUFC has a much more "laid-back" view of things. The coaches and DOC's are well qualified and do a fine job training the players. They are not, however, focused on winning state championships. That just isn't the priority. Please do not mistake that for a lack of desire to win. Of course they want to win - as do the players. It just isn't the primary focus.
So, when harry pops in to tell us how "disappointed" he is that CUFC hasn't done better at state cup, and "wondering" when CUFC will compete better against CESA (without being honest enough to disclose that he is a CESA guy who was really interested only in gloating), I was impelled to chime in. My message is: Don't worry about CUFC. We're doing fine, doing things the way we do them. CESA is doing fine, doing things they way it does them. Just stop using state championships as the be all and end all of a successful club.
Last edited by HappyDaddy; 12/20/08 02:50 PM.
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Quote:
Coaches are not required to keep scouting/recruiting books on the other teams in the state in their age group.
I have no idea about the internal workings of what the directors and CESA do as far as everything that you say in this post. However, I will tell you, upon transferring, one of the things that most impressed my son about his coach was the fact that he had a scouting report on the team he left, down to the individual players abilities and tendencies. Whether that was mandated by the club, or what the coach did on his own, it showed the commitment level of the coach to be able to develop that from watching other teams in the age group. I remember the drive home and talking about that with a statement of "not only did he have it, it was right".
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Perfectly understandable reaction.
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 273
corner kick
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corner kick
Joined: Nov 2005
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Quote:
Quote:
Coaches are not required to keep scouting/recruiting books on the other teams in the state in their age group.
I have no idea about the internal workings of what the directors and CESA do as far as everything that you say in this post. However, I will tell you, upon transferring, one of the things that most impressed my son about his coach was the fact that he had a scouting report on the team he left, down to the individual players abilities and tendencies. Whether that was mandated by the club, or what the coach did on his own, it showed the commitment level of the coach to be able to develop that from watching other teams in the age group. I remember the drive home and talking about that with a statement of "not only did he have it, it was right".
OK I have to ask this, I know it is off topic but it is really the only beef I have with kids playing at clubs outside of their local club.
Bear - I'm using your post to get this out but please don't take it as criticisim. You mention in your post that you drove so I'm assuming he is/was not old enough to drive suggesting that he is/was still in middle school or a freshman in highschool when you switched.
So my question, What can a child of that age gain by switching to a club that far away that they can not get in their own back yard? and at that age is the minor advagtage they may gain worth the cost? When I say cost I'm not talking about the monitary cost but the physical, social, and educational.
I know this is a very individual question and I just want to get peoples thoughts.
"We do not quit playing because we grow old, we grow old because we quit playing."
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don't assume anything about his age. me, personally, even if my child is old enough to drive to greenville, certainly does not mean i am going to LET them drive all the way up there by themselves. not saying that nobody does it.
and, it's also very possible that bear enjoys watching his son (and team) practice. there are actually parents who do that.
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SoccerPop,
Trust me, I don't take anything about that decision that my son made, as criticism. There are some on this board that know the full dynamics of our personal situation at the time when I supported his decision. CHT has on many cases said, it should be the child's choice, and it was.
As for age, he was old enough to drive to practice.
As for the costs that you mention, physical, social and educational. Grades were better during the fall season when we had it, since we had the monitored time in the car. Social, trust me, he has managed just fine. I'm not sure of any difference with physical, but, we got into a routine, sleep in the afternoon on the way up, practice, study on the way home.
My wife and I both ejoyed our 1 on 1 time with our son on Thursday.
As you said, it is an individual situation, and for us, we still feel it was the best decision we made at the time.
If you want more details, PM.
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