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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 270
corner kick
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corner kick
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 270 |
Quote:
Quote:
ZM, I thought you were a CESA member?
I have purchased one year worth of CESA - with my same USA coach.  Go SOLO...
Isn't that like buying a Mercedes just to keep it in your garage and look at it?
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 270
corner kick
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corner kick
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 270 |
Quote:
First, I assume you are referring to girls, not boys. I don't know any men's college coach who goes to HS games unless it is to watch a player he has already identified through club. Second, if you consider that there are probably 20 SC colleges with women's soccer, each recruiting a minimum (educated guess) of five ladies per year, I'd say four out of one hundred proves my point.
HD: You do realize you are debating two different points, right?
And once again just because you don't know of a player that was recruited at a HS game, doesn't mean it hasn't happened.
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 270
corner kick
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corner kick
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 270 |
Quote:
All you need do is look at the rosters for Wofford, Furman, CofC, Coastal, USC, Clemson, Lander... to see that all of these schools recruit nationally and internationally. If you think that the chances of any of them recruiting a SC kid who played only Classic or Challenge (with minimal to zero wider experience) is more than marginally north of 0, you're mistaken. No speculation necessary.
The fact that you have brought up national and international recruiting, begs the question that perhaps the local players are simply not good enough -- despite the participation in events you allude to.
More to follow - I have exceeded my quota for the day, week!
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 688
goal
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goal
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 688 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
ZM, I thought you were a CESA member?
I have purchased one year worth of CESA - with my same USA coach. Go SOLO...
Isn't that like buying a Mercedes just to keep it in your garage and look at it?
No - my kids get the love and attention of a GREAT coach, the organization and all of its bells and whistles.(will discover those as we go) at the same price I was paying! 
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 32
kick off
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kick off
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 32 |
Quote:
Quote:
All you need do is look at the rosters for Wofford, Furman, CofC, Coastal, USC, Clemson, Lander... to see that all of these schools recruit nationally and internationally. If you think that the chances of any of them recruiting a SC kid who played only Classic or Challenge (with minimal to zero wider experience) is more than marginally north of 0, you're mistaken. No speculation necessary.
The fact that you have brought up national and international recruiting, begs the question that perhaps the local players are simply not good enough -- despite the participation in events you allude to.
More to follow - I have exceeded my quota for the day, week!
And this is were I see the problem (which is maybe for another thread). I have had coaches flat out tell me that a player (yes, in most cases but not all, my son) was put on the lower team because HE (I've said it before, the girls game is a different monster) was smaller. These coaches have admitted that the two or so players are better technically than those that made the team, it was there size. This has happened from u11-u15. So they have already been pigeon-holed and we all know that in most cases size eventually equals out. In fact, my son came home from school last week, he is a freshman, and said he heard the coach was only looking at freshman player x and freshman player y because they play premier. True or not, that's what the players are thinking. Maybe SC players aren't good enough because many of the coaches think they can make players out of some of the bigger, faster (and many many times) less dedicated players.
To tell the truth, I could give example after example where in my sons age group( because I have seen them all play for years) where the all the smaller players are moved down and it doesn't matter if they are better soccer players, even if they demonstrate so in games.
I will also say that we are at CESA because 1) it is the most convenient and 2) my son's friends are there and he doesn't want to leave. He already goes to a high school that he is not zoned for, thus "losing" many friends.
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 404
goal
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goal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 404 |
Reccos - Quote:
HD: You do realize you are debating two different points, right?
Yep - I am capable of doing that.
There's a saying about exceptions that prove the rule that applies here. As I said, pointing to four recruits out of 100+ tends to prove my point. I have talked to many college coaches about the recruiting process and the conversations are always the same - on the boys side they recruit from the Development Academy first, second and third, then from Premier League/ODP/USYS. HS soccer is a non-entity for recruiting purposes.
Zen Master -
My son had a fine HS career, but you're absolutely correct - it was meaningless in the recruiting process.
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 630
Goal
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Goal
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 630 |
I will also say that we are at CESA because 1) it is the most convenient and 2) my son's friends are there and he doesn't want to leave. He already goes to a high school that he is not zoned for, thus "losing" many friends.
How does he do that? Is that legal?
Victory Starts Here!
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,256 Likes: 2
Coach
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Coach
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,256 Likes: 2 |
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There's a saying about exceptions that prove the rule that applies here. As I said, pointing to four recruits out of 100+ tends to prove my point.
Simply out of respect for the rules of logic and probability...just because one person who happens to post on this thread happens to know four players who were exceptions to the theory, it would be awfully hasty to assume they were the only four out there.
If, from all of the hundreds (thousands?) of people involved in SC soccer, we could find people who know just double the number of addidional exceptions known by the one (I'd call that fairly good odds) we're up to 12 out of your hundred (given your 100+ designation, we'll round to 10%.)
Now, while the odds are definitely in favor of the high-level club players, I'd still call 10% more significant than "marginally north of 0."
Then we get into the issue of causality. Do people become blue-chip players because they choose to travel? Or do they choose to travel because they are blue-chip players? That's kind of on the same line as asking a club, "Should the blue-chip players come to you because you win a lot of championships, or do you win a lot of championships because the blue-chip players choose to gather there?" Does the club make the players, or do the players make the club? Or some combination thereof?
My point is, there is definitely value to playing at the highest level and getting as much exposure as possible--no need to have to defend the investment; I don't think anyone's rationally calling it a waste--but there is no "only" path. It's a myth. The other paths may be more difficult and may require a lot of effort and some pure luck...but they exist. There is no "only."
Granted, the girls' game is a different monster indeed, but I worked with a girl in high school and Classic club ball who got called to an interview for Clemson and was actively recruited as a keeper by VT...right alongside a girl from New Zealand, if I remember correctly. I'm glad nobody ever convinced her that if she didn't have the "right" opportunities coming along, she had absolutely no chance to compete.
I've got good news and bad news...
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,256 Likes: 2
Coach
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Coach
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,256 Likes: 2 |
Quote:
I will also say that we are at CESA because 1) it is the most convenient and 2) my son's friends are there and he doesn't want to leave. He already goes to a high school that he is not zoned for, thus "losing" many friends.
How does he do that? Is that legal?
There are several conditions that can allow a student to attend a high school he's not residentially zoned for...NCLB opens a lot of avenues, magnet schools and IB programs can draw from other zones, and parents working at a school are allowed to bring their children with them even if they live outside the attendance zone of that school, just to name a few of the possibilities.
I've got good news and bad news...
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 404
goal
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goal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 404 |
Coach -
Your point is hypothetical, so I can't say whether it's valid. It may be. Even so, I would be very surprised to learn of girls who are recruited to play in college who have not, at least in the very recent past, played very competitive club soccer. Of course there are going to be exceptions, but I think very, very few. I freely admit to knowing far less about the girls' side of things. On the boys side, the reality is that you have to play highly competitive club soccer to be recruited. I've looked at most all if the freshman classes (men) at the SC colleges and can only think of one or two SC kids who didn't play either USSF DA, Premier League, or Challenge League with a bunch of big tournaments on top of it.
I'm not saying that it is impossible to take a different route. It is possible, as your personal example illustrates. I'm saying that one's chances of playing in college are minimal without having played very competitive club soccer. That's just the reality.
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