SC Soccer Forums SCSoccer.com Forums Club Soccer & ODP What College Soccer Coaches Say About ODP

>> [Chopper] Club ball is great but how many SC players were in the Disney showcase ? I think it was none at the U17-U18 level.<<

I think this will prove your overall point about how few SC players were at Disney. 2 teams from SC were there; 16 teams from NC were there; 13 teams from GA were there.

MPSC Ice U-18G and SGS Santoz U-14B teams went to Disney.

I know of two SC U-14 girls that went; one plays for Charlotte and the other guested with a team from Massachusetts.

>> [4soccer] ODP may be ok for the 50% of quality players who can afford the expense. The other 50% of quality players cannot get by the political selection process or the expenses. -$50 for a tryout??-
If ODP were less costly and less political, you would have the majority [80 to 85%] of quality players, instead of 50%. I have seen pure political examples where ODP coaches picked their own sons for their own team. I have seen other players that can't make their club's A team, yet they are selected for ODP. If you have the money you will make the team. Maybe this comes from the political, good-old boy system promoted by SCYSA. <<

I know I'll get in trouble for defending SCYSA and ODP; but I know lots of people who have money who had children that didn't make the team in the two years in which I've had a child involved. Not just a few -- a lot. So it's hard to believe that money is the only qualifying factor.

In terms of the value of the program given the expense, I don't know how to answer that other than it comes down to an individual family choice. I haven't seen where the SCYSA gouges anyone on pricing. The $50 tryout fee included 4-6 hours of evaluation, two jerseys, and high-level coaches who traveled to get there -- so I didn't think it was outrageous -- but I recognize this is a value judgment.

In terms of the process being "political" -- again, I haven't seen it. Have I seen questionable selections? Sure -- a few -- but never among the top 1/3 or so of the players selected -- and only once among the second 1/3 of players selected [again, only in my experience]. Most of the heated discussion and argument I've heard is around the bottom 1/3 of players selected -- and given that the point is to select a national team, I'm not sure how much it really matters.

Are there aberrations such as you note [e.g., parents selecting children, B team players instead of A team players]? I've not seen them, but I'm not going to stand here and say any program this large is perfect. Just because I haven't seen them doesn't mean that they don't exist. But at the same time, I'm not sure you define a program such as this from one-off incidences.

Now, as to the assertion that only the best 50% or so of players try out -- again, in my very limited experience of two years, I haven't seen it. I've had a child playing club on challenge level teams now for 5 years, and so I'm pretty familiar with the players within +-1 year of her age, and can tell you that other than 2-3 players from one team that has a coach that reportedly [note: I have no first-hand knowledge of this -- it's just a rumor] discourages the players from playing ODP, I see the best players at the tryouts. But as I've noted repeatedly, my experience is limited.

Let's imagine for a second that it is true that only the best 50% try out. You note two reasons for this: politics and money. I haven't seen politics as an issue; and if it's money, then it seems to me that those that care about highly competitive SC soccer should be contributing to a "scholarship" fund that would allow the SCYSA to have players come into the program who can't afford it. If you can convince me of this I'll sign up to contribute -- but first you're going to have to explain to me that parents who care enough to spend money on challenge level soccer and to spend their time supporting their children doing this make the decision that they can't afford ODP. Again -- I understand a parent/player deciding ODP doesn't provide value given their personal goals and situation -- I just have some trouble with affordability given the parents that constitute the potential pool from which to draw ODP candidate players.

Now -- with all of this said -- I do think that there are very legitimate issues that are raised about ODP -- but they aren't administrative, they are strategic. People I respect tell me that we don't put enough players into the region or national teams [note: I've had the pleasure of seeing several regional, and one national, player practice and play for the last few months and can tell you that there's nothing political about how skilled they are.] People [and I know you have noted this as well] say that we sometimes have too many players on teams, or that ODP teams don't practice enough, or things like that. I think that those may very well be legitimate issues and worthy of deeper analysis and discussion. I'm just not seeing the same things you are in terms of some of this.

I still believe that the college coaches realize that the ODP selection process involves more politics than high level club selection process.
But it all comes down to a choice- if you are on a good challenge or premier team (i.e. St. Giles Celtic, CSC Burn 87, GFC 85) that travels to top tournaments then you will receive substantial exposure. If you are on a decent challenge team that can get accepted to top tournaments and you play ODP, then you will receive substantial exposure. But I also still believe that the high costs and politics of ODP keep some of the top players from considering ODP.

chapindad--

the exposaure that you daughter is getting is great, but there some of the best players in the state do not try out, because most people think of odp as not a big deal in SC. because of the reputation of odp in SC, a lot of good players do not come to tryout for the team. ALSO the cost can be a problem. if some of the better players in the state would try out and make a better rep for sc odp, then other good players in the state would try out. there's always an issue of having players who arent at the highest level that still make the team.

We must not forget that there usually is only a few "top notch" teams in an age group that can go to the major tournaments to get exposure. Everyone cannot get on these teams. Take a team like the Aiken team, St. Giles Celtic, or GFC U18. You might have a really good player that can't crack one of these teams due to geography, talent, or even politics. The politics don't start at the ODP level. Club politics can be just as bad.

observer1121 -

I agree with you completely. My daughter might not even make the team if all the best players for her age group came out to play. That is why we are considered a joke at the regionals. I still have hope that this is the year for us to make a dent. My daughter feels and shows great pride playing for SC at the camp and seeing that pride is what will keep me in the game as long as I can afford it.

After reading complaints about ODP and politics...

There is an alternative structure to ODP which also serves to place players on the regional and national teams. It is Super-Y and is run outside of USYSA (and thus SCYSA) entirely.

The only Super-Y club in the state is in Aiken (Diadora United) and has coaches such as Justin Rhodes (NSCAA Advanced National License, Region III Champion Coach, etc.) and Heather Frederick (NSCAA National License, 2003 SCYSA coach of the year, state championships, ODP coach, etc.). It is a summer league and tends not to conflict with club or high school and to allow flexibility with summer vacations and other obligations. My daughter has never played in it before; but people who have had children play there have reported that the training and coaching are very good.

So if you have or know of a player good enough to make ODP but didn't go out because of the "politics", this is another way of going about it. While tryouts have already been held, I believe that much like club ball these folks are always looking for good players.

I keep reading posts about political selections and finances keeping the best players from playing.Sorry, but I just haven't seen it. At most there might be 2 or 3 players in the 88 age group that could step in and make an impact on the team that haven't tried out.I know the families of 2 of the three and neither politics or money keeps them from playing. They have other priorities.As far as SC ODP being a joke.At least on the boys side, we have shown very well in past several years at region camp.By continually criticizing ODP you act like SC ODP is a laughingstock in region 3. I don't believe that to be the case.

The link below describes the new Super Y ODP system. As you can see selection to its ODP teams involves extensive observations by many coaches during match play, rather than in a couple of tryouts. It may also be substantially less expensive. But you have to first participate on a super Y team. As MC stated Aiken has the only Super Y league in SC. I would love to see Super Y teams started in Cola.
http://supery.uslsoccer.com/

BDad11: I haven't seen it on the girls side on a widespread basis either. I know of exceptions (e.g., an astoundingly good keeper didn't participate because of basketball conflicts) -- but I haven't seen widespread trends due to politics or costs.

However, I always want to allow for being wrong...so if I'm wrong (and even if I'm right), I hope we'll see a lot of kids playing Super Y in Aiken this summer.

P.S. If I get a chance, I'll try to spend an hour or two pulling up some data to try to understand this further...pretty hard to analyze...