SC Soccer Forums SCSoccer.com Forums Club Soccer & ODP relegation/promotion

Ain't it funny how these threads inevitably wander over to the topics we like to rehash from time to time.

This thread started about promotion / relegation. The number of posts, sorted by subject:

3 Promotion / Relegation
3 Growth of soccer / third division
14 Club vs. JV

How can we steer this to what's really important (e.g. The Redneck League, The Evil Red Empire, The Best Player in the State, The Worst Referee...)

l: took the words out of my mouth, or off the tips of my fingers.

What are some of the advantages and disadvantages to playing up a year in age?

Kitten.... The exception to the rule is exactly that an exception. You cannot possibly believe that because of one rare find that all are the same. Adu's brother will be playing at George Mason University next fall, guess what...he cannot drive himself he is only 15.

The problem is to make sure the individual in question is MATURE physically and/or psychologically to handle the event. It is up to the coaches to make sure that is the case, a 5'4" 120 lbs 18 year old knows exactly what he is in for. Your argument, to me, does not appear to hold water in other sports. Simply they would not be selected.

Hurst....Girls...absolutely different story, speed/size is less of a concern. But then we continue to make exceptions

Regarding playing up...I am a strong believer that there are many advantages to playing up. I also believe that it is MY DUTY to determine IF playing up is the right thing for the player. This should not be taken lightly. If the player is selected to play up, then they MUST PLAY and not sit on the bench. I actually challenge my girls by playing up often, only because I know we are competitive, otherwise I would not.

And Lurker/Greengrass....sorry ...I was tyring to agree with a comment and it exploded on me.

I was under the imopression that there are many levels in club soccer. Premier, challenge, classic, and academy/developmental.

When it comes to high school and club, many high schools place their teams in club level in the off-season. Some high schools benefit from their kids playing classic becasue then the high school coach (who doesn't have to be licensed) can take all the training that the club coach (who has to be licensed and is usually a better coach) and translate that into a winning season with little or no effort.

Gotta love it!!!

futbol,

How does my arguement not make sense? What you said is exactly what I explained as my point.

The point of my entire arguement was that there should not be a full on ban against being able to play at a higher level due to age, but that it should be left up to the parents to decide whether or not to allow their child to go out for a team (risk, skill, travel, money, other factors) and up to the coaches to decide whether or not the player is capable of participating with the team (skill, attitude, personality, etc.). That allows the exceptions to play up and those who cannot to play in their own age groups because they will not be selected for the older team.

My bringing up the size with regards to age was simply to point out that an arguement purely against size was not infallible being that pure size differential exists at any age. I felt it served as a point that such a strict delineation could not properly serve players or teams and that it should be left, as I said, to the parents as to whether to allow the children to play up or not and to the coaches as to whether or not they select them for the team.

Fan,

The real goal would be to have a competitive enough program to have your entire high school team playing together at the CHALLENGE level. Home run here if the kids can benefit from both a very good club coach and a very capable high school coach. NOTE: It is hard to be competitive at the challenge level if you are going to restrict your team geographically to one school district.

And I'd like to note I wasn't involved in this drift—

Hurst,

Perhaps a more achievable goal would be to have your HS team all playing club soccer, period, let alone Challenge level. There are some teams that have that, and they get talked about quite often.

I have to chime in and agree with what Addidaskitten is saying. Having also had the opportunity for my child to do the same thing. He was able to play and contribute on the HS Varsity team as a 7th grader, became a starter as an 8th grader, and has 3 SCISA State Championships as a Sophomore. So in addition to competitive club play, he has been able to gain other field positional experience against faster, stronger players. I think it has contributed greatly to his overall development.

Were we concerned about burn out and injury, absolutely. However, we put the faith in our coaches, both club and HS, to have his interest in mind. When they noticed he was tiring near the end of the season, we cut it back. Interestingly, once the rest of the team realized at practices he could in fact play and hold his own, they not only involved him, but also "watched out" for him on the field. When the HS match was very physical, the coach wouldn't put him in.

I've found this debate interesting every year, and in the end, if the player is ready and committed, and the coaches are mindful of the play on the field, it can work. Is it for everyone, no.

As for physical size, if you put Convey in with most U16 teams with their backs to you, you couldn't pick him out.

Now for a comment related to the topic.

Right now the SCYSA has the responsibility of trying to keep it competitive for the entire group. Within their responsibility exists the authority, within USYSA guidance, to develop the policies. Clubs have the choice of whether or not to become and remain organizational members of the SCYSA, and yes it looks like they have a monopoly. However, with that said, they also have to keep the members thoughts in mind. If enough of the membership was to draft a proposal for promotion/relegation and work through the proper channels then maybe it would work.

Most competitive leagues around the world, and even in other states, have some mechanism for promotion and relegation, where it's in the rules, and if you want to particpate, that's what is followed. You would end up with some very good matches with teams facing relegation. As an example, look at the current U16 boys, with DSC, CESA, and Bridge. Taking nothing away from the finals, the semi-finals for two years have been great matches, because they have been fighting for the automatic spot in RIIIPL. If you were to make it such that a team had to earn and maintain a spot in higher league, then the competitive level would increase with it. That assumes however that the parents in general see that highly competitive matches, even with losses, is better for Johnnie/Susie than blowing out a team and winning a title. I've known some teams in the past that have had confidence issues. What was the solution, drop down to Classic and blow everyone out and win a title, and then move back up. This decision was made by the coach/club. While it helped their teams confidence, it was at the expense of the other teams.

Players are members of clubs and clubs are members of the SCYSA. Until we break the feelings of this is "my" team, and what's best for my team is what the SCYSA needs to do, then, we will continue to trail other states.

I guess that may have been a little off topic, but that fits with the rest of the thread.