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From another thread...

>>[RotR] You guys are trying so hard it almost looks like you are trying to convince yourselves and not 202677!<<

>>[Chico] RotR: I guess it depends on your perspective. [...]<<

In another thread, the subject of biases has come up. It made me think about the quoted thread, and about the subject in general. I thought I'd take this one simple exchange to illustrate how a lot of people tend to think on this message board.

There are several roles that people tend to fall into on the message board: player, parent, coach, club administrator, affiliating organization administrator, etc. Each comes with a unique set of biases. For example, I'm a parent; thus my bias is always "player first" and in particular "player I'm related to first" and "club she/he plays in first" and "high school she/he plays in first" and so on. You have to work really hard to even have a chance of escaping your biases -- and even then it's probably not possible.

Beyond that there are the biases associated with specific youth soccer clubs, specific ideologies (e.g., capitalism, socialism, etc.), and the like.

It would be nice to make judgments about what you read on the message board, or in any form of communication, without taking biases into account. I don't know many who can do it. I'm always deeply suspicious when someone tells me that they're unbiased; it typically means that they're either fibbing to me or self-delusional.

What I try to do instead is to call out any and all biases I have so that I "wear them on my sleeve." I realize that there are many folks that think by pretending a bias doesn't exist, that you make it less noticeable. I don't think that way -- I think the less you talk about potential biases the worse they become. My modus operandi, as it were, is to ask questions and try to understand the logical position of others.

Okay -- in any case -- I wanted to use this as an example of how others read bias into remarks. When I read 202677's comments, I was honestly confused. I believe she/he is a parent of a kid that plays in the Richland Northeast area, and I couldn't figure out how a parent wouldn't want this type of thing offered. That's why I asked the questions. Still don't understand the position; but that's pretty common for me on this board when folks don't answer questions.

When I read the quoted comments, I knew that RoTR was a DOC and coach at a club that wasn't the one taking teams to the Jefferson Cup. So my "bias alert" went off and I wondered where the poster was coming from -- with my having a sneaking suspicion that the comment was coming from a competitor of the club taking teams to Jefferson Cup just not liking the fact that competition was occurring. However, this is absolutely "taking a leap" with an assumption so what I did was to get on, try to explain why I was asking the question, and ask for help in understanding the position -- or even if there actually was a position.

I'd say about 25% of the time I walk away from threads not understanding someone's position -- and 75% of the time I walk away not understanding the reasoning behind a position.

It's okay to have an underlying ideology of "my [club, kid, coach, state, etc.], right or wrong." But most people don't think that they honestly believe that; most honestly believe that they're expressing a reasoned and well-informed opinion. Thus, it's through dialogue that folks can learn from each other.

In any case, thanks for the remarks folks have made in this and other threads; while I don't understand some of them, it helps to understand that there are different perspectives on things and helps me understand more concerning "knowing what I don't know."

Chico—You are pulling the Modernists on our threads into the Postmodern world.

I, too, prefer to lay my assumptions on the table—embracing the stance that objectivity doesn't exist, thus the pursuit of such is futile.

That is also how I teach; as humans, we can only be subjective, looking at the world through the eyes and experiences we are handed.

Having a bias is not the problem; being naive enough to think you are bing objective—THAT is the problem.

p&y,

I am Jesuit educated so I prefer to subscribe to "Seeing God in all things".


Chico,

I prefer the role of "Entertainer"....or perhaps "Facilitator of Information". I enjoy mixing humor, sarcasm and obscure historical and rock 'n roll references within my posts. I'm all about promoting this great game that I love so much. I have four daughters who still actively play so my bias is towards the womens side of the game.

Not sure if I fall into the self-delusional category but you may be on to something??? In fact, my wife thinks you are dead-on!

This is not soccer related, and may appear absurd to some, but since one of my favorite writers died last night, I thought I would enlighten the forum members that are interested with some of his quotes ~

http://www.vonnegut.com/

True terror is to wake up one morning and discover that your high school class is running the country.

Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before.

I know of very few people who are dreaming of a world for their grandchildren.”

Life happens too fast for you ever to think about it. If you could just persuade people of this, but they insist on amassing information.

New knowledge is the most valuable commodity on earth. The more truth we have to work with, the richer
we become.
Kurt Vonnegut, Breakfast of Champions

Another flaw in the human character is that everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance.
Kurt Vonnegut, Hocus Pocus

We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful what we pretend to be.
Kurt Vonnegut, Mother Night

We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be.
- Kurt Vonnegut, In Humanity

What should young people do with their lives today? Many things, obviously. But the most daring thing is to create stable communities in which the terrible disease of loneliness can be cured.
- Kurt Vonnegut, In Loneliness

History is merely a list of surprises. It can only prepare us to be surprised yet again.
- Kurt Vonnegut, In History

I wish that people who are conventionally supposed to love each other would say to each other, when they fight, 'Please—a little less love, and a little more common decency.'"
- Kurt Vonnegut Jr., "Slapstick" ( $ ) ( ? ), In Love

Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before," Bokonon tells us. "He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way.
- Kurt Vonnegut, "Cat's Cradle" ( $ ) ( ? ), In Education

Before you kill somebody, make absolutely sure he isn't well connected.
- Kurt Vonnegut, "Slaughterhouse Five" ( $ ) ( ? ), In Hate

"Don't be reckless with other people's hearts, And don't put up with people that are reckless with yours."
Kurt Vonnegut

We are healthy only to the extent that our ideas are humane.
Kurt Vonnegut

Kilgore Trout once wrote a short story which was a dialogue between two pieces of yeast. They were discussing the possible purposes of life as they ate sugar and suffocated in their own excrement. Because of their limited intelligence, they never came close to guessing that they were making champagne."
Kurt Vonnegut
Breakfast of Champions,

bless you, 2004striker—i just published a book on vonnegut—so i had myself a bit of a cry this morning—

Reading, Learning, Teaching Kurt Vonnegut
http://www.peterlang.com/index.cfm?vID=66337&vLang=E&vHR=1&vUR=3&vUUR=4

so it goes. . .

Anyone ever notice a kind of weird resemblance between Kurt Vonnegut and House?

Good stuff purple. I wish you success with your publication.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/13/opinio...&ei=5087%0A

..with Stroke's post and the events at VTech today - I find this (one of my favorites) Vonnegut quote to be appropriate.

"I saw that sign," said Dwayne, "and I couldn't help wondering if that was what God put me on Earth for---to find out how much a man could take without breaking."
-Kurt Vonnegut- Breakfast of Champions

A tragic past few days—all the more reason to enjoy the good stuff—like watching and cheering for the young soccer players we love—

Hope everyone enjoys as many matches as possible this week. . .

I agree purple, that we need to be all about enjoying this life that we are in, whether it is soccer or marbles or whatever. We need to enjoy and love life better than we currently do.

Jack (formerly known as The LE Dudeman),
It is possible that this young man lost it because he could not handle rejection and loneliness.
------------------------------------------------------------
What should young people do with their lives today? Many things, obviously. But the most daring thing is to create stable communities in which the terrible disease of loneliness can be cured.
- Kurt Vonnegut, In Loneliness

I wish that people who are conventionally supposed to love each other would say to each other, when they fight, 'Please—a little less love, and a little more common decency.'"
- Kurt Vonnegut Jr., "Slapstick"