Okay, if you could respond to this point it would help me. I know of a certain age group right now where CESA is recruting about five kids for a team. I am not gettting into violations or anything, so don't get in that. It is word of mouth from a coach to a player to players. It will result in phone calls when appropriate as has happened in the past. Very simply..if these kids stayed with their club, they would likely be the favorite for State Cup, if not they would be right there in the finals. If they go to CESA, obviously, they will win hands down. This is my question and honest perspective. Did CESA do anything to develop these players while they will take credit if they win it all? Follow up, why is CESA pressing for players when they have a brand and program that is superior to everyone elses? This is where I think you are wrong, and it is subjective so we can argue all day. I believe CESA has been succesful because they have persuaded the best players at other clubs to play for them. Great job for CESA, but you have to admit that it is the talent they get more than the training they get (at least equally important). If you disagree with me there, we will have to agree to disagree.