Which of the following 3 schools has had the best boys soccer program in the state over the last decade(2002-2011)?
1.) IRMO (Current 2011 Rank - AAAA #1)
AAAA Champions (03,04) - AAAA Finalists (02,05,09,10)
Region Championships - 8
2.) NORTHWESTERN (Current 2011 Rank - NOT RANKED)
AAAA Champions (06,08,09,10) - AAAA Finalists (03,04,07)
Region Championships - 8
3.) SOUTH AIKEN (Current 2011 Rank - AAAA #4)
AAAA Champions (05) -AAA Champions (09) - AAA Finalists (10)
Region Championships - 6
Northwestern. The '09 squad was a powerhouse team,forgot to include their national #1 ranking.
NW - They've had more Championships and Finals appearances than the others listed.
I will say that the 05 S. Aiken team was possibly the best in SC history. Then again...it's hard to argue against some of those NW squads
Rather new to the area, but I would think Christ Church Episcopal School deserves to be in the discussion.
No offense to these teams but beating the likes Lincoln and Academic Magnet each year who have WAY more limitations than CC aren't exactly going to earn you points in this discussion. If you were to toss CC in there then you have to throw in BE, which, I'm simply not willing to let happen.
I guess it's how you define a program. For me a "Program" means having a tradition of being a competitive team year in and year out regardless of circumstances. The term "Program" also means having leaders on and off the field with integrity, honesty, and a winning attitude.
At least for 4A, and maybe overall, I would definately have to say Northwestern. The only year they weren't finalists since '03 was in '05 when they lost in the upperstate championship to South Aiken who went on to win it all. NW has been the most dominant team in 4A the past decade without a doubt.
I'm not saying the schools mentioned don't fit that criteria.
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No offense to these teams but beating the likes Lincoln and Academic Magnet each year who have WAY more limitations than CC aren't exactly going to earn you points in this discussion. If you were to toss CC in there then you have to throw in BE, which, I'm simply not willing to let happen.
I second this motion.
Northwestern overall and the 2009 NATIONAL champions is the best team in SC history.
I think for this decade, Northwestern has to be the program of the decade but a case could be made for Irmo as well. With the recent success of the trojans against Irmo in state finals, I think NW is more deserving of program of the "decade" title. However, Irmo is still the program that defines South Carolina High School Soccer. It would take another 15-20 years of this same level of success for Northwestern to have reach the standard that Coach Savitz has accomplished in his tenure at Irmo. Would be interested to see the results for all Irmo/NW games of the 2000's including regular season and playoffs. I know NW use to be a regular participant in the Lake Murray Challenge.
I will also agree with the previous poster about that '05 South Aiken team. They were phenomenal with Goose in goal and Geathers up top. The Irmo team they beat in the final was an Irmo team coming off back to back State Championships in '03, '04 and that had 12 seniors and something like 9 returning starters. And South Aiken beat them twice that year.
Northwestern All-Time Results vs Irmo:
07-06-00
'81 L 0-1
'84 W 1-0
'91 L 0-5
03 L 0-1
04 L 2-4
04 L 1-2
05 W 2-1
06 W 3-1
07 W 6-1
08 W 2-1
09 W 3-1
10 L 1-3
10 W 4-2
I'd say NW would be the only team in the state with a winning record against Irmo.
If you are talking about the best programs over the past decade you need to include some of the 3A teams from the upstate. Greenville's 07 team may have been the best team in SC history. They ended as National Champs and I believe only gave up a few goals the entire year. You also need to include Riverside who has won either three or four titles since 2000. J.L Mann and Eastside have also been dominant teams in the upstate that could have played with any other high school in the state. Some of these teams have competed and done very well in Palmetto Cup which is supposed to be the elite teams.
Also I think you would have to add BE. Even though they do play a lot of smaller schools they can hang with the big boys too. I believe they have won the Palmetto Cup a few times in the past decade.
I agree that Irmo and NW are two great teams and maybe the best this year but I think the people on here completely forget about some of the other schools that are not 4A.
Anyone know what it looks like when you compare Irmo and Northwestern's success at the Palmetto Cup since that is on more of a "National or Regional Stage" with several out of state teams?
Great point SweetFeet, that Greenville team of '07 was quality. It's easy for everyone to get caught up in 4A but 3A has had some gems too. The '05 Eastside team was also another great team. I think Northwestern and Irmo just seem to get such a large amount of recognition because of how consistent they have been. How many state championships this decade have at least one of those two teams featured in? 1 maybe?
If I was gonna make my list of a top 5, think it would look something like this...
1)Northwestern
2)Irmo
3)BE
4)Greenville
5)Wando
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Anyone know what it looks like when you compare Irmo and Northwestern's success at the Palmetto Cup since that is on more of a "National or Regional Stage" with several out of state teams?
Irmo has never competed in the Palmetto Cup.
Northwestern has participated six times, compiling a 14-8 overall record. However, since 2006, the Trojans have competed three times and won the title in 2006 (5-0), finished 7th in 2007 (2-2), and placed 5th in 2010 (3-1). That is a 10-3 mark vs. excellent competition, which includes the following scores vs. out-of-state teams: 2005 vs. Farragut-TN (10-1 W); 2006 vs. Christian Brothers-TN (1-2 L); 2007 vs. Noman North-OK (7-2 W); and 2007 vs. Farragut-TN (1-3 L).
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Northwestern overall and the 2009 NATIONAL champions is the best team in SC history.
Really misused term. National Champions of the 10 or so states that play now, which powerhouse states like Florida, Texas, and California don't.
Wait...why has a team as talented and idolized as Irmo never completed in the cup? I'm sure Farragut would have loved to play the yellow jackets!
Putting BE in the program of the decade isn't even fair, they can recruit and get the pleasure of playing 2A!!! Sorry!
For a team who has been written off in recent years, South Aiken has performed quite well. I remember reading posts over the last three years about how they won't win their region and such, only to go on and play for 2 state championships. For the amount of hype the three teams(Irmo,NW,SA,) received, only South Aiken has out performed their hype in my opinion
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Northwestern overall and the 2009 NATIONAL champions is the best team in SC history.
Really misused term. National Champions of the 10 or so states that play now, which powerhouse states like Florida, Texas, and California don't.
FYI - At least 13 states play boys spring soccer.
TSO obviously you don't know much about it because if you did you would know that big states like that aren't that good, first because all players are spread out, and second of all a lot of them don't play because they don't take it serious, it's not as serious as we take it here in South Carolina.
I think Greenville has won 3 state championships this decade and Eastside has won it once and been in it twice. Not bad in a crowded 3A.
It is very impressive that NW and Irmo consistently make it to the state finals but I feel as if it because there aren't as many elite teams in 4A. In 3A there is always a crowded top with Eastside, Greenville, Riverside, Mann, Daniel, BC, MB. Now they may not all be as good as NW or Irmo but all these teams are forced to battle for the shot at the title game. Makes it more difficult to consistently make it there.
True, but you also got to admit that the stars of the NHS team that were "National Champions" were also the core of the U18 team that also won the actual National Championship that year too. Yes they had some great non NHS players on that team but the star was ENZO and his NHS teammates were key players on that team (pretty sure there were more NHS players on that team than any other 1 school).
No doubt over last 10 years NHS has been the top boys school program in SC, Irmo was a clear second.
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TSO obviously you don't know much about it because if you did you would know that big states like that aren't that good, first because all players are spread out, and second of all a lot of them don't play because they don't take it serious, it's not as serious as we take it here in South Carolina.
Hahaha are you kidding me!!?? California, Texas, and Florida have the most talent BECAUSE they're big states! They have more variety of players and more competition to win they're state.
Don't believe me? Check these Top 100 National Players and add up all the players from California and compare how many there are compared to South Carolina.
http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/players-to-watch/players-to-watch-top-100/men
Now looking at all this talent from other states you don't think that there just might be some team out there that is possibly better than Northwestern? Do you honestly think they deserve the title as NATIONWIDE CHAMPIONS?? I think they deserve to be in the top ten at best.. But not #1
Is there anywhere online that has video of the 2005 South Aiken team?
SJE: YESSSSS, players there are much better, not disagreeing with you BUT team NO, NHS 2009 had Enzo Martinez UNC, Robbie Benson CofC, Shawn Ferguson CofC, Zack Clark LU, Clayton Gladden CofC, Alex Martinez HPU, Dennis Moore WC, Ricky Garbanzo CCU, all those went D1 and of course Ricky is on his way, Jermey Dobbins Lander, Cody Parks could of gone to Limestone, and Ryan Foster didn't wanna play soccer in college but could have if he wanted to, not good enough?1?
Barca could you ride NW's **** any harder?!
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Northwestern overall and the 2009 NATIONAL champions is the best team in SC history.
Really misused term. National Champions of the 10 or so states that play now, which powerhouse states like Florida, Texas, and California don't.
You'd still have to consider NW to be up there against teams from those powerhouse states. A good portion of that same NW team also won the U18 USYS National Championship with Discoveries. Something has to be said about that accomplishment when looking at top teams. They accomplished it at a club level, why not at the high school level?
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SJE: YESSSSS, players there are much better, not disagreeing with you BUT team NO, NHS 2009 had Enzo Martinez UNC, Robbie Benson CofC, Shawn Ferguson CofC, Zack Clark LU, Clayton Gladden CofC, Alex Martinez HPU, Dennis Moore WC, Ricky Garbanzo CCU, all those went D1 and of course Ricky is on his way, Jermey Dobbins Lander, Cody Parks could of gone to Limestone, and Ryan Foster didn't wanna play soccer in college but could have if he wanted to, not good enough?1?
My point is yes they had a lot of talent as a team Barca. But let's face it.. you know Ricky, Enzo, Alex, Dennise all of them because they're from YOUR school and state. Do you know any players from California? Texas? No, so do you think people from California know about Ricky? About Enzo? I'm not even sure they know about Northwestern! And like I said ealier yes I think in 2009 they should at best be in the top ten nationally but we should never assume that they are #1 in the nation and that they are nationwide champions. You have to remember that year that Northwestern went undeafeted they didn't play any out-of-state team. Almost the whole same team won U18 USYS National Championship, and for that they were in the top ten for me but not until we get a nationwide playoff bracket for high school soccer, we should not just easily say that Northwestern was the best soccer team in the WHOLE United States.
Interesting that Irmo has never competed in the Palmetto Cup. Also, that 10-1 score against Farragut sticks out like a sore thumb.
I wasn't bashing Northwestern or anything, I think they are clearly the answer to the original question, it is just annoying when people throw out terms like National Champions when they weren't. If 13/50 states play now, that means 37/50 don't. Odds are, especially since the big time talent states like California, Florida, and Texas are part of that 37, the best team in the country is from one of those 37. Just by simple odds.
And the talent in states like California is not more spread out, it is the opposite. The talent in this state is spread out, which is why there are so few dominant club teams. You could go to cities like San Diego and Dallas and have 3-4 teams better than CESA, even though CESA attracts people from the entire state. There are usually 2-3 great players on a SC high school team max, most teams are lucky to have 1.
Here is the #1 team from winter rankings:
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1 Montverde Academy (Montverde, Fla.) 24-0-1 1
Season complete. Montverde closed out the first undefeated season in the program's history with a 6-0 win over Seminole. The Eagles outscored their opponents 106-12. The team's key victories were over Tampa Jesuit (twice), American Heritage-Plantation, Bishop Verot (twice), Tampa Prep and Boca Raton. Juan Jose Morales led Montverde with 27 goals. Joao Victor Ramalho added 20 goals and 12 assists. Henrique Novaes scored 15 goals, David Graydon had 11 goals and 12 assists and Marco Warren contributed nine goals and 12 assists. The team is coached by former Clemson player and assistant coach Mike Potempa. All six seniors are committed to NCAA Division I or II programs and four of Montverde's six junior starters are being recruited by ACC schools and the other two are Division I recruits, as well.
Huge shocker that is is a school from Florida. All seniors playing college soccer. Four juniors being recruited by ACC teams (clearly the #1 conference). Northwestern had 1 player go to an ACC school, albeit one of the best HS players ever.
2000s
1. Northwestern
2. Irmo
3. South Aiken
4. Wando
5. Bishop England
6. Pinewood Prep
7. Riverside
8. Christ Church
9. Riverside
10. Spring Valley
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I wasn't bashing Northwestern or anything, I think they are clearly the answer to the original question, it is just annoying when people throw out terms like National Champions when they weren't. If 13/50 states play now, that means 37/50 don't. Odds are, especially since the big time talent states like California, Florida, and Texas are part of that 37, the best team in the country is from one of those 37. Just by simple odds.
And the talent in states like California is not more spread out, it is the opposite. The talent in this state is spread out, which is why there are so few dominant club teams. You could go to cities like San Diego and Dallas and have 3-4 teams better than CESA, even though CESA attracts people from the entire state. There are usually 2-3 great players on a SC high school team max, most teams are lucky to have 1.
Here is the #1 team from winter rankings:
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1 Montverde Academy (Montverde, Fla.) 24-0-1 1
Season complete. Montverde closed out the first undefeated season in the program's history with a 6-0 win over Seminole. The Eagles outscored their opponents 106-12. The team's key victories were over Tampa Jesuit (twice), American Heritage-Plantation, Bishop Verot (twice), Tampa Prep and Boca Raton. Juan Jose Morales led Montverde with 27 goals. Joao Victor Ramalho added 20 goals and 12 assists. Henrique Novaes scored 15 goals, David Graydon had 11 goals and 12 assists and Marco Warren contributed nine goals and 12 assists. The team is coached by former Clemson player and assistant coach Mike Potempa. All six seniors are committed to NCAA Division I or II programs and four of Montverde's six junior starters are being recruited by ACC schools and the other two are Division I recruits, as well.
Huge shocker that is is a school from Florida. All seniors playing college soccer. Four juniors being recruited by ACC teams (clearly the #1 conference). Northwestern had 1 player go to an ACC school, albeit one of the best HS players ever.
I am going to weigh in here and inform folks that Northwestern was the "National Champion" and deservedly so for the Spring Rankings. Just because 13 of 50 states (AK-AL-AR-GA-IA-NE-OK-SC-TN-UT-VA-WA-WY) play boys prep soccer in the spring does not make its champion any less of one from the fall or winter seasons.
I can assure you that the powers-that-be at the NSCAA, ESPN Rise, and StudentSports.com levels take the rankings as a very serious matter and do so with a pretty good understanding of just how good those teams are in their respective regions of the country.
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I am going to weigh in here and inform folks that Northwestern was the "National Champion" and deservedly so for the Spring Rankings. Just because 13 of 50 states (AK-AL-AR-GA-IA-NE-OK-SC-TN-UT-VA-WA-WY) play boys prep soccer in the spring does not make its champion any less of one from the fall or winter seasons.
I can assure you that the powers-that-be at the NSCAA, ESPN Rise, and StudentSports.com levels take the rankings as a very serious matter and do so with a pretty good understanding of just how good those teams are in their respective regions of the country.
Which wasn't my point. There can't be three national champions, unless we are talking about three different countries or three different sports. That is hypocritical. The more appropriate term would be Spring Champion, Regional Champion, etc.
It would be like if the American League and National League played separate seasons and we declared the winner of each league as World Series Champions. Or both the Eastern Conference and Western Conference champions as NBA Champions.
How is it "hypocritical"? I'm having trouble getting that through my head. Perhaps the word you're looking for is "redundant". I think it's implied that there is a Spring Champion and a Winter Champion. Would it be cool if everyone played at the same time and we could crown 1 National Champion? Sure, but even that would be invalid considering they more than likely would never be able to play one another like the NCAA or Professional sports do.
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I am going to weigh in here and inform folks that Northwestern was the "National Champion" and deservedly so for the Spring Rankings .
TSO you missed his point read the bold print. We are in SC and we play in the spring so the only National Champ we can compete for/care about is Spring Rankings. No one is sayig they were the All Seasons North Amercian High School champs, and anyone claiming they were champs has to reference the ESPN raie SPRING RANKING to do so.
However the fact that the NHS players were the core of the team that won the all U18 Boys Club Nationional Championship would go a long way my book to say that they could very well beaten any school team in the country that year. Beside any time you have the national player of the year (spring or fall) on your team you may just do ok.
I know this is High School and all, but DSC 90 Green won Nationals, where were the Florida, Texas, California teams?
TSO: Also NHS 2009 National Champions were 24-0-0, better record than Montverde.