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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 558
Goal
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Goal
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 558 |
Quote:
Does anyone remember my "language" comment on an earlier post? This weekend, we had a kid from a AAAA school elbow our goalie twice in the face while they were awaiting a corner kick, and after that SPIT in our defender's face and GUESS WHAT - the ref standing five feet away walked in and warned OUR GOALIE! The ref 50 yards away sprinted in and yellow carded the G kid (thank you), and tournament director Jonathan apologized after the tournament and said that he saw the whole thing and that it was awful.
We have three torn jerseys from kids grabbing our kids and slinging them down. One of the dirtiest teams we have ever played.
Could have fixed the whole thing if we had hit the last two PK's after going up 1-0 in PK's.
That's girls' soccer if the refs let it get out of hand, and we all know that happens. But you know, when a kid spits in a kids face, she should be banned from high school soccer forever.
I've been following the posts for a month or so concerning profanity on the fields, and now spitting at an opponent enters the discussions. It seems that the general concensus of parents and coaches alike is everyone would like the game cleaned up.
Here's the part I don't understand. If the coaches want to rid the game of the proliferation of profanity and other forms of unsportsmanlike conduct being reported here, just do it. Get the Coaches Association in agreement (sounds like the coaches posting here already agree) and approach the Referees Association and request to have the laws of the game regarding such conduct that are already in place enforced uniformly around the state.
I have to admit I'm not familiar with all of the local high school rules that may override FIFA's "Laws of the Game", so full enforcement of FIFA's rules on our high schools' fields may not be possible.
There are 7 deadly "sins" that require (FIFA, possibly not SCHS) sending a player off... straight red, no yellow. Two of those 7 deadly "sins" are (per 2009-2010 FIFA "Laws of the Game")...
Sending-off Offences
A player, substitute or substituted player is sent off if he commits any of the following seven [including two here] offences:
• spitting at an opponent or any other person
• using offensive, insulting or abusive language and/or gestures
Banning a player for life for spitting on an opponent might be a little over the top, but showing a red card is already on the books. A yellow card for spitting is not on the books. Now, the hard part... 5 minutes left to go in the state final, it's 0-0 and your player spits on an opponent. How committed will the coach be to cleaning up the game in that situation? Or, do we allow the official some amount of judgement? That is why I suggest the Coaches Association come to an agreement before approaching the Referees Association.
One of the aspects of this game that I always liked more than any other sport is the consequence of being shown a red card. We hear plenty from our kids about "Mom, Dad, you don't understand the peer pressure...". Good, the kids understand peer pressure, and we all know there is plenty of negative peer pressure out there to go around.
However, there was a time when you could see a player about to erupt, and you would see a teammate grab him/her by the jersey and pull the player away before the eruption could occur that surely would result in a red card. Forget what we as parents and coaches think about cleaning up the game, the players themselves will begin cleaning up the game if by not doing so they keep losing game after game due to playing down numbers, because Sally or Johnny can't keep a civil tongue or spit in his/her mouth. Finally, we have incentive for positive peer pressure. Of course, it could hurt for a while and drive a few coaches bonkers waiting for habits to be broken.
Consider this. When Dennis Rodman would headbutt refs and get thrown out of games and suspended, the media would ask Michael Jordan his thoughts. Jordan would say how great Rodman was, the team misses him, and hopes Rodman can work it out with Management and return to the floor. If after one of those headbutts Rodman had been ejected and the Bulls were not allowed to replace him on the floor, how long do you think it would take for Jordan to get in Rodman's face and say, "FORGET MANAGEMENT. I'M TIRED OF PLAYING 4v5 AND LOSING CHAMPIONSHIPS, CLEAN IT UP OR GET OUT!"? (Instead, what we got without a red card rule in basketball is a cult hero with bad hair in celebrity rehab.)
Actually enforcing the existing rules may sound a little harsh (probably cost teams a few games), but it seems many players today almost view being shown a yellow as a badge of courage ("Sally really told her off, AND she got a yellow card." "Cool, you go Sally!"). If the coaches feel conduct on the field should be held to a higher standard... then, just do it. The rules are already in place to support the effort. All we're missing right now is the commitment.
Oh, don't forget to check out the 5 other deadly "sins", then come back and re-read the posts in this thread.
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,659
world cup
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world cup
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,659 |
Kids play sports because they find it fun. Eliminate the fun and soon you eliminate the kid.
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,509
hat-trick
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hat-trick
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,509 |
Quote:
Here's the part I don't understand. If the coaches want to rid the game of the proliferation of profanity and other forms of unsportsmanlike conduct being reported here, just do it. Get the Coaches Association in agreement (sounds like the coaches posting here already agree) and approach the Referees Association and request to have the laws of the game regarding such conduct that are already in place enforced uniformly around the state.
Try convincing the ADs to pay for three referees. Only 2 referees were assigned the games at the Viking Cup except for the semi-finals and finals which had three each.
Quote:
I have to admit I'm not familiar with all of the local high school rules that may override FIFA's "Laws of the Game", so full enforcement of FIFA's rules on our high schools' fields may not be possible.
Since the SCHSL is not a member of USSF/FIFA, the FIFA laws do not apply to high school matches. The high school league is a member of the National Federation of State High School Associations (NFHS) which has its own rule book. The rules are, however, very similiar to FIFA's with some fairly minor differences. The "deadly sins" you mentioned are also send off violations under NFHS rules.
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 281
corner kick
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corner kick
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 281 |
Careful what you ask for. Uniformily giving red cards (which is the required action for foul language)would only hurt SC. Remember, those in charge are not soccer people and would jump at the chance to hurt the sport.
Also, they don't enforce other "high school rules" evenly either. Embellishing is a yellow card offense in HS. How many time have you seen a player fouled then roll around on the ground like they have been stabbed. That should be a foul and then a yellow card on the "embellisher". Never seen it happen and diving/embellishing is a horrible problem in the soccer world.
"Boys, even if it means dying on the pitch, we must win!" Marc-Vivien Foe 1975 - 2003
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 319
Corner Kick
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Corner Kick
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 319 |
Mustabeen listenin to my album before the game...Grab some ablibs out my box
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,521
hat-trick
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hat-trick
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,521 |
Why are only two referees assigned to each game at such a big tournament? Smaller tournaments I can understand there is not alot of money to be made but something the size and stature of the viking cup? How much more monies are we talking about? Why have three referees at the semis and finals if two were enough for most of the tournament?
What message are we sending?
As far as the rules on profanity..The rules hold no water if they are not enforced..I can hear it up in the stands and no one is being sent off the field..That does not mean that the ref should hear everything I hear..but I am sure he/she hears more of it than I do..
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 147
goal kick
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goal kick
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 147 |
The NFHS rule states the following ejection-reasons (red card) and I quote Quote:
spitting at an opponent, teammate or official; using offensive, insulting or abusive language or gestures;
a yellow card is used for incidental foul language.
Of the games this weekend I watched/observed I don't recall hearing any profanity directed at an official or another player. In fact several parents commented on Friday night how they enjoyed the majority of the teams good sportsmanship this weekend. I did hear a lot of abusive language from a parent or two though....
Last edited by SV-Dad; 03/08/10 03:18 PM.
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 688
goal
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goal
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 688 |
Just more wood for the fire...
Had a ref this weekend worried about the net and it hanging a little, and not being tight.
THEN, he lets two boys JV teams try to kill each other.
One young man got dribbled, so the next time the kid came near him he tried to break his sternum, with an elbow. Head on crash. Chest to elbow.
Later one boy gets rid of the ball, then about a second later gets slide from behind, and lands on his neck and shoulders.
The one thing we should worry about is our childrens safety. If they are using foul language, and are spitting that starts at home and hopefully reflects on the parents and the young people. A coach can make this stop. (A good coach would)
The coaches however encourage strong physical play... and the line gets crossed, way too often.
The other night I saw one young lady take three elbow shots to the back of her neck and skull. That was supposed to be a point of emphasis... guess the ref, could not hear at all. This is not allowed in MMA, why do we allow our kids to do it?!?!
Another young lady was walking the ball out of bounds, while the other player pounded her back. Once the ball went over the end line, the pounding turned into a two hand shove, where the girl landed on her head, shoulder and chest. The ref sent her off... no card, guess srimmages are good for all sorts of violance.
Sticks and stones worry me more than words. Words can not hurt other players...
Last edited by ZEN MASTER; 03/08/10 03:51 PM.
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,509
hat-trick
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hat-trick
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,509 |
Quote:
Why are only two referees assigned to each game at such a big tournament? Smaller tournaments I can understand there is not alot of money to be made but something the size and stature of the viking cup? How much more monies are we talking about? Why have three referees at the semis and finals if two were enough for most of the tournament?
What message are we sending?
During the regular season I believe the answer is that the AD's do not want to pay for the third referee. The referee assigner for the Columbia district has told them all that he will assign three if they request it. I was at Irmo last year and we had three for all of but two home games. We also had 3 referees for every game at the Hungry Howie's tournament. My experience has been that 3 referees will be provided if the coaches/AD's request 3.
As far as the Viking Cup, it could actually be for the reason the coaches always seem to think: "There aren't enough referees". There were six tournaments running simultaneously in the Columbia district this weekend and the referee pool may be a little thin to provide three officials for that many simultaneous games.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,521
hat-trick
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hat-trick
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,521 |
Thanks..Coach P..
Money should not be an issue..Ask me if I am willing to pay to have a third ref..Of course I would..
But I also expect the refs to make the call..
You can have five refs on the field and the game still get out of hand..If you don't make the calls..
If this means slowing the game down until players "get it"
I'm okay with that too..
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