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From WSPA 7 tonight. I'd say this video should end the debate, even though the sports anchor talks about the "white line"

http://wspa.com/2016/05/14/j-l-mann-fall...game-2-1-in-ot/

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He ran because the ball was kicked up the field. He knew it wasn't a goal.

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Originally Posted By: EaglesFutbol
It's been established (with evidence) that the goal line is the black line in FRONT of the white line. If the ball hit the white line when it came down (as the photographic evidence shows), then it's a goal. If the AR believes, during the game of play, that it is NOT a goal, then he should have done as you said. The AR didn't. Instead, he ran back to midfield as ARs do when a goal is scored. At the end of the day, you can't argue the facts and the evidence with opinion. If you want to really just blame someone, blame whoever left the player open to take that shot


Nobody is disputing the fact that the black line is the goal line. However, the ball can hit the white and still not be a goal. The entire ball must cross the black. Just because a portion of the ball hits white does not mean the entire ball entered the white area.

Also, you are completely wrong about the AR responsibility. On a straightforward goal, yes tha AR turns and runs toward the center line, no flag. On a questionable goal with play continuing, if the AR believes it to be a goal, the AR should stand his ground, raise his flag, make eye contact with the center and then run toward the center line with his flag still raised.

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Fortheloveofthegame That is one heck of a statement you put together. I saw the whole thing and this center ref should never be allowed to coach another soccer game, much less a championship game. Thanks for those thoughts. Now, who do we call!!

Originally Posted By: ForTheLoveOfTheGame
Congratulations to Lexington.

Mann....tough loss.

In all my years of watching soccer (and there are many) and watching dozens of high school soccer state championships, I have never seen such a debacle as the SC 4A championship between Lexington and Mann. This officiating crew should be banned for life from the pitch. It was by far one of the worst jobs ever done by a crew that I have ever witnessed. Clearly the fiasco at the end of the game with the goal called in golden goal overtime where the AR visibly, demonstratively, and verbally indicated it was not a goal is what everyone will be talking about; however, this crew was simply awful the entirety of the match.

There was the non-PK call at the 7 minute mark of the first overtime period where a defensive player restrained an offensive player in the box by grabbing her shoulder with a hand full of jersey and pulled her back so the keeper could corral the ball (watch the tape…it is very clear). There was no doubt this was a PK in real-time yet the center swallowed his whistle like nothing happened. There were the two botched calls in the 2nd half on Mann #15 who should have received a second yellow and forced Mann to play down a man; but again, the center cowered at making the right call. That of course assumes that the first yellow he showed was correct…that would be a wrong assumption. Then of course he was more than willing to whip out another yellow card for unsporting behavior for sending the ball away after a foul. I have a real problem with referees who are fast to throw soft yellows for minor infractions or during stoppages in play yet refuse to make the right decision on plays that can get someone hurt. Let’s talk about the dozen or so handballs that were never called. How a qualified referee can miss that many simple calls like that is unbelievable. Ironically however, one of the ARs must have x-ray vision because he called a handball on a ball that was chested and all he could see was the player’s back. Then there is the AR calling for an offside free kick when it was a goal kick. He didn’t even know what was going on in the game. How about the handling offense on the Lexington keeper in the 1st half that was not called just outside the six…clearly that was a Lexington defender trying to shoot on her own goal and not making an intentional pass back. Are you kidding me? Then there are the offside calls when a “defensive player” plays the ball back. How’s that? Is there a new offside law?

That takes us to all the fouls that were called, I disagreed with about 80% of those called (way too many of those were very soft touch fouls); and, all the fouls that were not called that should have been called, with which I disagreed 100%. Call the fouls consistently please. It was such a pitiful display of incompetence that was so totally random and inconsistent that it is extremely hard to believe that this guy actually passed the certification test let alone was chosen to do a championship match. I would also love to see the foul stats on this match as they had to be outlandishly one-sided against one team.

Finally, that brings us to the mayhem in the final minute of the first golden goal overtime. The shot is taken, hits the bar, bounces down off the line, and out into the field of play. The AR does not indicate goal, he simply begins to follow the ball back up the field. The Lexington players do not complain. Suddenly the center stops the match and calls goal. Chaos erupts from both teams and fans. The center goes over to the AR who verbally and demonstratively indicates that it is not a goal, which was witnessed and overheard by a multitude of players, coaches, and spectators. The Mann players and bench celebrate the “no-goal” they believe is about to be called when suddenly the Center for no known reason indicates “Goal.” What a complete abuse of power. The center was in no position to make that call. He must defer to AR on the line. To overrule the AR in that situation is ludicrous from an officiating standpoint. And, as has been shown in the many pictures floating around on the web already, the entire ball was NOT over the goal line. The picture floating around that shows it best shows the ball kicking up black crumb from the white football line just behind the goal line. While the center of the ball did land behind the line, the laws of physics with the angle of attack of the ball coming down preclude the entire ball from having crossed the line. It was not surprising when this crew immediately made way for the clubhouse and left chaos reigning still out on the pitch. Now there are stories that the AR is changing his story to the state officials and saying that he did tell the Center it was a good goal. The many witnesses and the reaction of the Mann team clearly refute that. Now it’s merely a cover-up to try and save face for this entire crew and the state association.

In soccer, many times players and/or coaches will complain that a referee cost them a game, which is simply not true…they just had a bad game but it impacted both teams. In this case however, one referee had an absolutely abysmal game and not only did it cost one team a game, it cost them a championship.

Bottom-line is this…whatever happened on that pitch tonight was awful and there needs to be some real inquiry as to what truly went on with this referee and this crew at this championship match. It is unacceptable!

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But I'm saying he ran back up field because the ball was cleared out of the box. That is the only reason he ran.

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Originally Posted By: ghs26
From WSPA 7 tonight. I'd say this video should end the debate, even though the sports anchor talks about the "white line"

http://wspa.com/2016/05/14/j-l-mann-fall...game-2-1-in-ot/


This is a good look but there is no definitive view that shows the entire ball over the black goal line. In fact, this is a good view to show that the ball hit the white close to the black line, which lends more credence to the presumption that the entire ball was not over goal line. Then when you take into account the goal posts were wrongly placed a few inches back into the white, the argument for no-goal is stronger.

Bottom line....with photos and videos we cannot agree if it is a goal or not so how could the refs in real-time definitively say it was a goal. Impossible.

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Am I looking at a different photo and video?? If there was no white between the black line and the rubber I would understand the argument. But you can pause the video at 38 seconds and just like the photo you can see white between the ring of rubber pellets coming up and the black goal line. I have no idea how a ball could hit there without completely crossing the black line.

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Originally Posted By: EaglesFutbol
I've no doc in this fight but was following the game on Twitter.......saw the video & if it wasn't a goal & the AR had ruled, during the game of play, that it was not a goal, then why did he start running to midfield as if it was a goal? If he initially believed it wasn't a goal then he should have kept in line with the last defender when she cleared the ball

Plus, that picture is all you need to see the ball clearly crossed the line. If y'all do wanna blame someone though, blame the Rawlings ball. It's all Rawlings' fault
i

Love it....yeah blame Rawlings. How come this new, fancy Rawlings ball did not have goal line chip technology embedded in it?

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^ I am going to disagree.

Pause the video at the 35 second point and you can see that the front of the goal post is in front of the black line. Which suggests that the back of the goal post is lined up with the back of the black lune, which is where it should be right?

And if that is the case and the ball bounces completely inside the white area as shown on the photo close up that would suggest that the whole ball is past the black line.

Plus the black dots that kick up would be almost the exact size of the ball so if the ball was on the line the black dots would be on the line too.

But photo shows space between black goal line and spot where ball hit. And more than enough space to suggest it was clearly behind the line.

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Originally Posted By: ForTheLoveOfTheGame

Bottom line....with photos and videos we cannot agree if it is a goal or not so how could the refs in real-time definitively say it was a goal. Impossible.

You mean the Mann supporters can't agree.

Everyone else including that news channel seem to think it is a goal.
And say what you will about the refs, but they look to have got it right.

And you don't even need the photo or instant replay. Just think of the trajectory of the ball. Hits the post then comes down towards the back of the goal and hits the ground then bounces back up out of the goal. If the ball didn't go into the goal it would bounce differently.

It would have hit the post and came down away from the back of the goal and towards the field of play.

BTW I downloaded the 1st video and watched in slow motion and it is clear the ball hits post and takes an angle towards the back of the net not to the front and out of the goal.

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