SC Soccer Forums SCSoccer.com Forums Girls Varsity Soccer HS vs Club coach?

Ryan Roseberry,
Thanks, my theory still holds true.

Same thing with Coach Chass's comments about players that helped on his team. I had some girls at Westside who did not play club and were athletic, stepped it up, had heart, etc., but then neither Berkeley nor Westside were dominant, highly ranked programs with a realistic shot of making it to the state championship.

No amount of heart and determination from any group of girls that does not have a few years of competitive club experience under their belts is going to beat a TL Hanna or a Wando.

Berkeley High is ranked 101 on the 2007 poverty index and Westside is ranked 105. Out of 48 AAAA schools, there are 35 and 37 respectively that have a wealthier mix of kids than these two schools. Spartanburg is ranked 1 lower than Westside in the AAAA poverty index and they find a way to be a top 10 school every year. It may take more creative methods to get kids into club, or to sell them on the idea, but I think athletic, CLUB players, at our schools will be what ultimately closes the gap.

Agreed, completely. Still, we seem to be overlapping conversations between whether there is no GIRL who can be competitive (to me, this means competitive in skill level with other individuals, able to perform on the field, worthy of recognition and eligible for play at the next level) without club training and whether a TEAM can be competitive without club training. These two points are not the same.

RR
On the SDE website it has the Berkeley district ranked 28th with a poverty index of 64.95 and Lexington 4 (swansea) has a PI of 79.88 and ranked 60th.
The PI in Lexington 4/Swansea has more than doubled since 1996. However, Swansea continues to close the gap. Furthermore, making it affordable for kids to play helps!
2007-district-report-card-poverty-Index.xls

Chass,

Sorry about not being specific as to keeping my point focused on an individual player vs. team being able to make an impact. I still think neither an individual nor a team can make an impact at the highest level without club training.

Meredith,
I think I looked at a different link on the poverty index, but I know Swansea is able to do a lot with what they have. I interviewed for the HS English position at Swansea High in 2002, but was not that interested once I found out there was no girls soccer program. 6 years later they have a competitive squad, thanks in large part to LLSC, which I'm sure a number of your girls play for, and I imagine play together, too.

I would also imagine that LLSC does a good job in keeping club costs down, which is another big draw for the girls. It's hard to talk a girl who comes from a low income demographic into convincing her family to pay at least $600 dollars to play club. The lower the cost, breaking up payments, and offering scholarships to players, etc. are all ways of getting kids to participate.

I also imagine it benefits Swansea to have a somewhat local club where there girls can play together, as opposed to having them try out for Lexington or CUFC initially. It is hard to convince girls to try out for a club that is made up mostly of players from schools that your girls lose to by a large margin on a yearly basis. Not only are your kids intimidated, but the players from stronger schools can be condescending initially. Given time, the girls make new friends, and realize they can compete at a higher level, and it works wonders for their mentality at the high school level when facing the aforementioned schools.

In 2008, Westside Varsity Girls had 6/15 (1 Challenge, 4 Classic, 1 Rec) girls who played club the previous fall season, and 11/15 that had at least played club at some level before. In 2009, Westside Varsity should have 10 girls who played club soccer in the fall of 08 (2 Challenge, 8 Classic) and 13 that have at least played club at the classic level before, plus 5-6 on the JV team that played club soccer in the fall of 08. It will be interesting to see if the rise in numbers affects how competitive we are against teams that were stronger than us in 2008.

Meredith,

Looks like you're checking the PI for the districts rather than the individual schools. In some districts, like Barnwell 19 (where I used to work) they're one and the same...Berkeley County is a very widespread district, though, with an equally wide array of communities feeding into the different schools. The demographics for Stratford and Hanahan, for example, are significantly different from those of Berkeley High, or Timberland or Cross.

Another thing that's worth checking when making comparisons is the breakdown of the demographics within the school zone, not just the PI. In many communities, there is a high poverty index because the majority of residents fall below the poverty line, but yet there still exists a core of affluence that still feeds into the school system. In a 4A school, it doesn't take a large percentage of the population to form a pretty decent soccer team. I wonder how many of the high PI yet successful teams' players actually come from that minority that can afford club, equipment, and other investment? If only 20 kids out of 1000 can afford to play year-round, you can still make a more-than-decent team. Just some thoughts.

And yes, RR, that does mean I recognize the importance of extra training and experience to form a highly competitive team. I agree completely about the team...I will disagree about the individual, but only in the case of the rare exception. That at least gives us a 50% accord...better than most folks here!

You are dead on about the advantages to the players of clubs that keep the costs down...that is a major factor for many. You're right about the intimidation factor too. I had several girls from my high school team try out for club last week; they were almost scared to death to go and try to compete for spots on the team with players they thought were "elite." I think this is part of what is holding a lot of them back from trying out...we have billed this as an elite sport with elite programs, and those just starting out are afraid to get shown up and embarrassed by trying to get in on it. I like the fact that there are more and more opportunities for young players who have not necessarily grown up with the sport to find a place where they "fit" and get the experience that will make them better players.

CJ
I loved that movie.

RR,
All very good points. However, I remember getting drilled by Dutch Fork 12-0 and with a region with BC, Airport, and Chapin-trying to become competitive is the driving factor of playing club. I coach in LLSC club and we all volunteer our time to make club available to our kids ($150)-it's a good thing. Why don't other clubs do the same? I know there are various reason. But, we are trying to expand the sport to include, not to exclude. However, you make some very valid arguments!