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goal
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The stats from SCSoccer show 43 goals and 8 assist nonetheless a great year. You may want to get them to update his stats if that is the case.
I don't want to offend but even the level of competition Dillon played in 2A was questionable. Your team was 19-2 this year and still wasn't ranked in the top 10? You only played 1 ranked team all season which was a loss (0-4) and your other loss was to a 1A team that was 3-11. If you can even remotely consider this kid on the Super Team of SC what is he doing in club soccer? I consider 3A soccer very suspect in it's quality. Yes there are teams at the top that are good but overall the quality is terrible. An average player can look good on a 3A field. IMHO 2A soccer is great competition but the skill level is way way below 4A where those mentioned are playing. 2A just doesn't have the numbers to field even partial teams with skilled players and/or athletes. Stats certainly do not paint the entire picture when it comes to SC high school soccer.
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corner kick
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corner kick
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Quote:
I will breakup the NWHS love fest a little by pointing out that besides NWHS their are some others players who would standout on any team of SC players when coupled with the talent on the field at NWHS. Simply put there are several players that if placed on the NWHS team would step in and provide the same level of play there or even better. It is hard to compare players from different team whose supporting cast varry so greatly but here are four who I have seen play NWHS many times and they have always been clearly been up to the same level (well no one has matched ENZO's footwork) of play as their opponents.
Tyler Vukoder Midfielder Fort Mill
Sean VanEtten Goalkeeper Fort Mill
Christian Datz Defender Fort Mill
Chris Landvik-Larsen Forward Fort Mill
Chief, lets be honest. These players you have listed are good players yes. But are not the same caliber as NW. How can you say they were clearly at the same level if they were beaten by a combined 13-1 or so in three games? Vukoder is legit but he never did much. VanEtten got scored on a lot. Datz got dribbled a bunch. And Larsen had countless runs but never really got the ball. I'm not trying to bash these players, bc they are good players. I just disagree with your statement of saying they are on the same level.
One Time!
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hat-trick
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Quote:
Quote:
I will breakup the NWHS love fest a little by pointing out that besides NWHS their are some others players who would standout on any team of SC players when coupled with the talent on the field at NWHS. Simply put there are several players that if placed on the NWHS team would step in and provide the same level of play there or even better. It is hard to compare players from different team whose supporting cast varry so greatly but here are four who I have seen play NWHS many times and they have always been clearly been up to the same level (well no one has matched ENZO's footwork) of play as their opponents.
Tyler Vukoder Midfielder Fort Mill
Sean VanEtten Goalkeeper Fort Mill
Christian Datz Defender Fort Mill
Chris Landvik-Larsen Forward Fort Mill
Chief, lets be honest. These players you have listed are good players yes. But are not the same caliber as NW. How can you say they were clearly at the same level if they were beaten by a combined 13-1 or so in three games? Vukoder is legit but he never did much. VanEtten got scored on a lot. Datz got dribbled a bunch. And Larsen had countless runs but never really got the ball. I'm not trying to bash these players, bc they are good players. I just disagree with your statement of saying they are on the same level.
I think Tyler Vukoder is at that level....and maybe a little beyond. Seeing as a bunch of them are all going to C of C, I guess time will tell.
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Corner Kick
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Corner Kick
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Quote:
The stats from SCSoccer show 43 goals and 8 assist nonetheless a great year. You may want to get them to update his stats if that is the case.
I don't want to offend but even the level of competition Dillon played in 2A was questionable. Your team was 19-2 this year and still wasn't ranked in the top 10? You only played 1 ranked team all season which was a loss (0-4) and your other loss was to a 1A team that was 3-11. If you can even remotely consider this kid on the Super Team of SC what is he doing in club soccer? I consider 3A soccer very suspect in it's quality. Yes there are teams at the top that are good but overall the quality is terrible. An average player can look good on a 3A field. IMHO 2A soccer is great competition but the skill level is way way below 4A where those mentioned are playing. 2A just doesn't have the numbers to field even partial teams with skilled players and/or athletes. Stats certainly do not paint the entire picture when it comes to SC high school soccer.
Well, I guess I did not realize that to be considered a top caliber player you had to:
1. Play for Northwestern
2. Play 4A soccer
3. Play club soccer
4. Play for a team that finished in the top 10
The debate should not be about the quality of the team. it's the quality of the player. We live in an economically depressed area where the opportunities to play club are limited. We try to schedule as best we can. We don't have a girls program so we have a difficult time getting matches with quality teams. 48 goals is 48 goals but I guess that means nothing if you don't play club ball or for Northwestern.
Coach Chickering
Camden High Soccer
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brace
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brace
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Quote:
Quote:
I will breakup the NWHS love fest a little by pointing out that besides NWHS their are some others players who would standout on any team of SC players when coupled with the talent on the field at NWHS. Simply put there are several players that if placed on the NWHS team would step in and provide the same level of play there or even better. It is hard to compare players from different team whose supporting cast varry so greatly but here are four who I have seen play NWHS many times and they have always been clearly been up to the same level (well no one has matched ENZO's footwork) of play as their opponents.
Tyler Vukoder Midfielder Fort Mill
Sean VanEtten Goalkeeper Fort Mill
Christian Datz Defender Fort Mill
Chris Landvik-Larsen Forward Fort Mill
Chief, lets be honest. These players you have listed are good players yes. But are not the same caliber as NW. How can you say they were clearly at the same level if they were beaten by a combined 13-1 or so in three games? Vukoder is legit but he never did much. VanEtten got scored on a lot. Datz got dribbled a bunch. And Larsen had countless runs but never really got the ball. I'm not trying to bash these players, bc they are good players. I just disagree with your statement of saying they are on the same level.
Well I think you have over looked the basis of my argument in your zeal to promote the NWHS line you have forgotten that the team aspect of soccer is the key to evaluating the true abilities of the players. If ENZO played for York HS he likely is not the all time leading scoreer or even on a state championship team. He is surrounded by top notch players who make it easier for him to excell.
In football terms how many time do you see a team add a big time back and all of a sudden the passing game kicks into high gear. It is the same, even more so IMHO for soccer.
Did Vanetten get scored on a lot by NWHS, yes. So would Foster, in fact having seen both play over 20 game (I have seen both of them that many times) I would argue that Vanetten is a better shot blocker, his reach on the dive give him a slight advantage over Foster. Not putting down Foster because he is excellent too but when it come down to one guy I think Vanetten would have been just as good in goal as NWHS keepers. Same goes for the other guys but in other ways obviously. You have to take the player and put him into this dream team and then see what they add to the mix. Landvik-Larsen is about as fast a striker you will see in the state (I think he is going on to play Div 1 football not soccer) put him on a front line with ENZO and Ricky or Dennis and his ability to blow by players would lead to a significant increaase in goals for him.
You have to remember that with these "dream" team concepts you will have to accept that guys who are good on a team with a couple of superstars will be supplanted by the great players from a team of mostly good players. You can no longer look at what the team did you most look at the players and see how they fair on thier own.
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corner kick
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corner kick
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and this is why hs soccer needs to divide into premier, d1, d2 and d3 so we can put all the best programs together.
honestly, those perfect records are embarrasing, irmo and nw had 1 and 2 real games all season...
and then you wonder why none of this kids would have any chance of going pro here or anywhere in the world and if they do, the bench would be their best friend.
Club of the century.
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goal
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goal
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Chick,
I said it was a great year and you yourself pointed me to the weak schedule. I agree that your location makes it difficult to schedule quality opponents. You may want to consider schduling another tournament with tougher opponents to lend a little credence to the schedule. As to your list:
1. Players listed are not all from Northwestern please don't associate me with the NWHS love fest.
2. Playing 4A soccer was used as an example of the weak defense encountered in 2A. Thus the stats may not tell the whole truth. I agree that students shouldn't be penalized for where their parents live. That is why I asked about his club experience. If he played it would have been a more even playing field to make comparisons.
3. Yep
4. Again used as an example of the weak defenses encountered in 2A. Thus the stats may not tell the whole truth.
Back to club...you may live in economically depressed areas but most if not all the clubs have scholarship programs in place for just these type of kids. If he is that talanted he should at least be at tryouts for the various clubs coaches to evaluate.
The club vs. High School soccer has been debated numerous times on this website. It would seem to me that top caliber players would have the ability to play post their high school careers. I would expect that the majority of college soccer players played club ball. My son plays 3A and in every instance that I can recall any opposing players that impressed me also played club at some level.
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goal kick
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goal kick
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I will breakup the NWHS love fest a little by pointing out that besides NWHS their are some others players who would standout on any team of SC players when coupled with the talent on the field at NWHS. Simply put there are several players that if placed on the NWHS team would step in and provide the same level of play there or even better. It is hard to compare players from different team whose supporting cast varry so greatly but here are four who I have seen play NWHS many times and they have always been clearly been up to the same level (well no one has matched ENZO's footwork) of play as their opponents.
Tyler Vukoder Midfielder Fort Mill
Sean VanEtten Goalkeeper Fort Mill
Christian Datz Defender Fort Mill
Chris Landvik-Larsen Forward Fort Mill
Chief, lets be honest. These players you have listed are good players yes. But are not the same caliber as NW. How can you say they were clearly at the same level if they were beaten by a combined 13-1 or so in three games? Vukoder is legit but he never did much. VanEtten got scored on a lot. Datz got dribbled a bunch. And Larsen had countless runs but never really got the ball. I'm not trying to bash these players, bc they are good players. I just disagree with your statement of saying they are on the same level.
Well I think you have over looked the basis of my argument in your zeal to promote the NWHS line you have forgotten that the team aspect of soccer is the key to evaluating the true abilities of the players. If ENZO played for York HS he likely is not the all time leading scoreer or even on a state championship team. He is surrounded by top notch players who make it easier for him to excell.
In football terms how many time do you see a team add a big time back and all of a sudden the passing game kicks into high gear. It is the same, even more so IMHO for soccer.
Did Vanetten get scored on a lot by NWHS, yes. So would Foster, in fact having seen both play over 20 game (I have seen both of them that many times) I would argue that Vanetten is a better shot blocker, his reach on the dive give him a slight advantage over Foster. Not putting down Foster because he is excellent too but when it come down to one guy I think Vanetten would have been just as good in goal as NWHS keepers. Same goes for the other guys but in other ways obviously. You have to take the player and put him into this dream team and then see what they add to the mix. Landvik-Larsen is about as fast a striker you will see in the state (I think he is going on to play Div 1 football not soccer) put him on a front line with ENZO and Ricky or Dennis and his ability to blow by players would lead to a significant increaase in goals for him.
You have to remember that with these "dream" team concepts you will have to accept that guys who are good on a team with a couple of superstars will be supplanted by the great players from a team of mostly good players. You can no longer look at what the team did you most look at the players and see how they fair on thier own.
Chris Landvik-Larsen is a good player, no doubt. He's one of the fastest sprinters I've ever seen. However, his accuracy on frame isn't nearly the same caliber at Enzo's or Ricky's.
One could argue that Enzo's club team is, in fact, a dream team. It consists of the following South Carolina players - Shawn Ferguson, Robbie Benson, Dennis Moore, Alex Martinez, Enzo Martinez, Tyler Vukoder, Ralph Lundy, Geordi Khoury, Aaron Mayes, Andrew Gorospe, Craig Lowe, Clayton Gladden, Zack Clark. The vast majority of the players list above have been selected as All- Region or All State and named to either the North/South Classic or the Clash of the Carolinas.
Chris Landvik-Larsen was on this same team with all of these players and while he was incredibly fast and could boot the ball like nobody's business, he lacked the accuracy on frame. He wasn't part of Coach Wren's starting eleven. He wasn't a leading scorer on the team, which by most estimations, would be the criteria used to determine whether or not someone was a "great" player, especially for a forward.
While Tyler Vukoder has been on this club team, he's always been a starter. He has been arguably the most consist player on this team, year after year. I would agree with Big Daddy that Tyler is at or above the play of NW.
-Attitude reflects leadership-
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bench
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Thomas Valkonis of Eastside, Manning Rushton of Greenville High, Miguel Teos of Eastside, Sam Mattern of JL Mann and Reid Grier of JL Mann can play with any of these guys
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Goal Kick
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Goal Kick
Joined: Jan 2004
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There was a world of difference in the quality of the players in this year's 3A and 4A championship game. Much more so than in previous years.
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