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I understand--everyone would be asking, "why did he allow the kick to be taken when players were obviously infringing?" The rules state, though, that in the case of infringement before the kick, the referee allows the kick to be taken. The action AFTER the kick is determined by the result of the kick.

If the kick is successful, it's a wasted effort due to the infringement and has to be retaken.

If the kick is unsuccessful and advantage is in favor of the defending team, play continues as if there was no infringement--no harm, no foul.

If the kick is unsuccessful and the attacking team still gains advantage (the ball is put back into play so that the attacking team has another chance to score), the play is stopped and a kick is awarded to the defending team.

I know, it seems unnecessarily complicated, but there it is. The officials who stop the play to adjust the position of the players prior to the kick are taking a "teachable moment," but they are not really supposed to do that under the rules of the game. If their encroachment costs their team a successful PK attempt, so be it!


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Coach Chass #162029 04/18/13 07:20 PM
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I assume, the rule is intended to allow these things to cover the player rushing in... not holding hands prior to permission.

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Switching sports... but think about it.

In basketball, the ref ensures the lane is clear before the free throw, then, hands the ball to the shooter to shot... A lane violation then turns the ball over, or allows another shot depending on who enters.

You have NEVER seen the ref, give the ball to the shooter with a player standing in the lane. Nor have we seen the ref allow two people at the PK spot for a PK. Those rules have to be for some jack leg rushing in.

Have you ever seen two take a PK?

Last edited by It is, what It is!; 04/18/13 07:29 PM.
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Coach N. As a referee, I can't declare a winner in a case of play ending after one half. That would be up to the HSL. If a referee can't continue, it is out of anyones hands to declare a winner except the high school league. In the case that you talked about with the referee injuring themselves, and was unable to continue in the second half...the game can be stopped there. You cannot go directly to PKs, that isn't allowed, you can only stop the game, and let the HSL sort it out. Where I am now....depending on the conference that I would be in, it would either be a tie, or the game would be replayed at a later date.

I had an injury one time in a state cup quarterfinal game. Had a U-18 guy accidentally step on me when I was back-peddling for a goal kick. It was about 2 minutes before half, and I limped it out until half. I ended up having to talk to the coaches, and had the 4th official come in and do the second half while I was the 4th offical for the second half. That is the only time in the many matches that I have done that I ever had to stop in the middle of a game. To me it was embarassing, but there was nothing I could do.


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James Gray #162032 04/19/13 02:46 AM
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Ok. I didn't think you could do it, but when he gave us the option to, I was confused. Thanks for the responses.

ON ANOTHER NOTE:
2 games in a row of bad officiating. Within 2 games, I have had definition, no doubt, can't deny it, fouls on my players and nothing. My keeper has taken cleats to the head, Player took elbow to the chest and head, and had a Player cleated in the stomach and nothing. No whistle, No breathe, Not even a "hey watch that." I'm sorry, but if the quality of officials keeps dropping, the "beautiful" game will be a black and blue game.

Also, heard from another game that a player slid from behind, which now had possibly ended a player's season and NO CALL. Just makes me shake my head

eMnAvA #162033 04/19/13 10:53 AM
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Coach N, I have also heard about some pretty suspect refereeing from my dad that is still involved in SC soccer. The stories that he is telling me I can't believe that the officials could possibly be that bad. But, reading everything on here it is telling me that you guys in SC have an epidemic of poor officials with no recourse to get them better. I would suggest putting a rating system in place, and start to weed out the bad ones. At our local association, we have blacklisted certain officials from being able to do varsity matches. The referees should be policing themselves to prevent a bad image. Our certified referees (we have three high school level referees in IL...registered, recognized and certified) have the ability to rate other officials that they referee with. That might not be a bad idea for you guys either.


If you are going to argue a point, at least get factual information to back up your side.....
James Gray #162034 04/19/13 11:52 AM
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Well along with the poor officiating, we are also short on officials. It's an endless cycle really until some one breaks it. Parents/Players who may be interested in officiating see/hear the game officials get belittled and fussed at which turns some away from wanting to do it which then leaves us with lesser quality to choose from. I will be going through this thread and reading all the systems people have suggested and see what ways they can be fit to our State. If no one else pushes something like this forward, the quality is going to keep getting worse. And if no one wants to do it, I'll do it. Good refs should get recognized for their good officiating and lesser quality refs should get critiqued, policed, and trained more.

Even from this, I may get chastised or told to shut up, but oh well. I see a severe issue and I am going to confront it.

Last edited by Coach Navarro; 04/19/13 11:54 AM.
eMnAvA #162035 04/19/13 05:11 PM
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Quote:

Well along with the poor officiating, we are also short on officials. It's an endless cycle really until some one breaks it. Parents/Players who may be interested in officiating see/hear the game officials get belittled and fussed at which turns some away from wanting to do it which then leaves us with lesser quality to choose from. I will be going through this thread and reading all the systems people have suggested and see what ways they can be fit to our State. If no one else pushes something like this forward, the quality is going to keep getting worse. And if no one wants to do it, I'll do it. Good refs should get recognized for their good officiating and lesser quality refs should get critiqued, policed, and trained more.

Even from this, I may get chastised or told to shut up, but oh well. I see a severe issue and I am going to confront it.




I am going to assume this is High School.

1. There are too many games on the same night. Why everyone in the world in certain areas have to play on Friday night, for example, is beyond me. This, of all things, greatly limits the number of officials that can be assigned. Either you need to separate the girls season and boys season or schools need to start playing on other nights.

2. Your assessment system for referees is as only as good as the assessors. Coaches can not be assessors they have a bias, they have a stake in the game. You need people from the referee associations to go out and assess referees. People who are already certified to assess referees by taking the USSF assessors course is a good start.

3. The verbal referee abuse needs to stop, from coaches and spectators. Referees need to stop it with cards or game terminations, and AD's need to stop it by actually going to some of these games to see it first hand. Finally the league needs to start punishing these schools, but you will never get younger referees if it continues.

4. Assistant Referee pay needs to go up to at least 2/3 the pay of the Center Official. In a lot of places it is only half. Some people dont want to go out and run two lines, however, a good AR is worth his weight in Gold.

arrgy #162036 04/19/13 05:50 PM
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1. Absolutely valid point.
2. Disagree. Sure coaches are biased. Sure they have a stake. Which is why you don't act on ONE coach's word, but consider multiple assessments by multiple coaches over time. As I have suggested here.
3. Agree, to a point. Because referees, too, can be biased, you develop a similar system for referees to evaluate schools' "game management." When there is a PERSISTENT problem, cited by MULTIPLE officials, the SCHSL (or whatever governing body you choose) levees fines/suspensions/both. SYSTEM IN PLACE FOR ALL SPORTS. If you've ever been to a high school basketball game, you know that the "abuse" you take in soccer is NOTHING compared with the environment in other sports.
4. Agree. But first, let's institute a valid (or at least better) system of evaluating officials, and reward those who consistently grade out best with better pay.

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Quote:



Have you ever seen two take a PK?




No, but you have!

Seriously, the commonsense thing in that situation would seem to be to tell the second player to move behind the line before the attempt was allowed. By the letter of the law, though, the rules were followed. Now, if the goal had been scored and had been allowed, THAT would have been a true head-scratcher!


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