SC Soccer Forums SCSoccer.com Forums Club Soccer & ODP One Club in Columbia

I'm going to take each line that can be responded to and attempt to respond so that I can learn from you folks.

>>All this is IS talk!<<

Yes, it's a message board. The best you're probably going to do is to discuss and to learn.

>>Nothing will ever happen to merge b/c it has to be something new not CSC!!!!!! Look how GFC did it all new!!!!! CSC is not the answer here!<<

Why does it have to be something new? You seem very, very certain that CSC is not the answer; could you explain in detail why CSC is not the answer?

CFC was something new; and it couldn't marshall the resources it wanted so it merged into CSC. So something new doesn't seem to necessarily be the answer, does it?

>>Untill ALL the clubs want to form one club in cola the talent will be split!!!!<<

I think that this is the heart of the matter in your argument, correct? Without a single club representing Columbia, GFC and St. Giles can't be beaten, right?

Okay, let's imagine that nothing matters but the talent pool from which you draw. 2000 census numbers for urbanized areas show Greenville with a population of 302,194 and Columbia with a population of 420,537. Thus, with 2 clubs, Greenville draws on roughly 150K. Columbia should then be able to support 2 clubs and win all of the time, or 3 clubs and be very competitive.

However, using this analysis, there's no way to beat Atlanta since it has a population of 3,499,840 and thus can always consolidate into just a few clubs and draw from a greater population.

I understand that you disagree with the theory that a competitive, regional/national oriented club environment in an area can beat a single, centrally planned club environment in that same area. And certainly there has to be a limit with respect to the number of clubs a given area can support. However, respectfully, population draw as the single most important attribute for soccer competitiveness might not be the end-all-be-all theory that is going to make Columbia-area soccer ascendent.

THE SOCCER GOD has spoken again!!!!!!!
I did not know that CSC & CFC have basically merged. Will they still retain separate names?
I am sure that CSC's mission will first be to take on GFC/St.Giles; then hopefully try to compete with CASL and Atlanta teams. Does anyone know how the player fees compare among CSC, NECSA,CRSA and the other state clubs in ATlanta/CASL? I know CRSA is about $300 a season w/o uniforms and NECSA is probably the same. I don't know CSC fees.

{Warning: another long post}
Mr. Underhill, to answer your post about why someone from downtown would drive to Ballentine to play for CSC, I'll give you my perspective. (My son played 3 years at NECSA, 2 years at CRSA, and the last year at CSC and plans on playing again at CSC)
He wanted to be on a team that could compete for a state title and play at the highest level (Region Premier League). For his age group the team that had the best talent and opportunity to achieve this was CSC. He has enjoyed playng for every team he has been on and never felt lacking for a quality coach at any club. Tripp and Kevin do a great job at their clubs and Eddie has and will at CSC also. My son started at NECSA because it was closer than Irmo and CRSA was just beginning to come on line (my decision). He moved to CRSA to play with his school friends (his decision). Every time he moved it was a tough decision on his part. And he finally moved to CSC (his decision) for a chance at playing at the highest level.
Other than his first year (classic) I have let him make his own decision on where and if he wanted to play. These kids are intelligent and the ones who have competed against each other know who the best players are in their age groups. (despite what they sometimes say about each other on the posts). I believe if the parents would support what their kids wanted to do, then the kids who truly have the "fire in their belly" to compete at the top level will migrate to the team that has the best chance for achieving their goal. For me, carpooling for a 30 minute drive to Ballentine is a small sacrifice to pay for my son trying to achieve a goal(no pun intended). (I might reconsider my stance on that if he comes to me tonight and tells me he wants to play at GFC or St Giles, so far I've been lucky)
One club in Columbia whose sole purpose is to compete at the highest level sure would make it easier for the kids who want to achieve that goal. But we the parents have not achieved that yet.
So on your post about why don't all the kids from BC and Dreher play together to form a good team for CSRA, the facts are to be on a great team from the Columbia area you need the kids from Irmo, Chapin, the Northeast, and downtown to achieve this. At his age group the CSC team has the most core talent.
As for the cost at each club, there isn't much difference in the basic fees, except the better teams usually play in more and better tournaments and obviously those tournaments cost more.

Semi-warning---Semi-long Post...
R2,
You gave a great real-life example about what a lot of folks have been discussing on this topic of one Cola.club/merger/no-merger/etc., etc.....
Once your child reaches a certain level of play they may need more challenges/opportunities to excel and they want to be where the best play.
So......what do players/parents want???? A nice, convenient environment for fun soccer, average soccer or high-level soccer??? Parents, do you want a club that is minutes away so you can drop of the kids and run the errands and go work out or visit with a friend? Or an exceptional club that is a mere 30 mins away.....compared to a drive 1 1/2 hours to Greenville?? I know what I want to see...... , (as I have stated much too often in this forum...) But there are too many divisions of thought and wants and needs on this subject for there to be a meeting of minds among the 4 area associations......Unless, of course the SOCCER GODS intervene......
So, where are we now on this highly interesting, stimulating discussion??
In examining the area clubs:
LSC is basically a slim notch above rec. play.
NECSA is able to handle Coastal clubs for the most part and Mid-district clubs(Discoveries,Aiken,CRSA)and play average ball in state tournaments.
CRSA is able to compete successfully with average teams from its district and Coastal clubs and also play average ball in state and out-of-state tournaments.
CSC is a different animal altogether...They easily handle Coastal and Mid-district clubs and also compete very well with GFC/St.Giles teams.
I make this brief comparison to say that there is a clear choice available for the area soccer players ---
1)LSC with nice fields and lots of playing time
2)CRSA with more competitiveness, yet average play and great coaches/organization
3) NECSA with even more competitive play, reasonable success, yet a more social, political environment.
4) CSC with great coaches/organization, fields, exceptional competitiveness/mission, yet the club with the most commitment of time and resources for players/parents.
I cannot say anymore on this topic (of course I have said that many times before!). So let the games begin....... maybe,just maybe, as this fall season progresses there will be tangible face to face discussions among the associations about the future of area soccer and their respective clubs.......

SHIM

WELL DONE!!! I got sidetracked there for a moment! Thanks for putting my mind back in it! Youa are CORRECT!!!!

R2
Thanks for he inside info! I can see your point on playing at he higher levels! I would like to see the BC and Dreher Freshmen play together!

Ok this is going no where the debate over the better clubs and the coaches. In my experience every coach thinks he better then every other coach. And at the same time one child will like a coach while another child won’t. So there is no point in arguing over the coaches because in each eyes they are the best.

As far as clubs go each club serves it’s own purpose. I think it is great that CFC and CSC are merging. That brings back all the girls teams that CSC had. I know the clubs in Columbia and I will say this about them. They each have separate goals they are trying to obtain. CFC and NECSA trying to be the biggest and the badest. CRSA is trying to be available to give the BC and Dreher players a place to play while becoming better for the high schools. And the Lexington Clubs while they had struggled in the past are becoming a little force. The boys have competitive State levels teams and have organized very well. And the girls Have just recently reorganized and are rebuilding what years of being held back has caused (they will surprise some people). The mission of the girls and boys club has been to service the Lexington area players that want to advance in soccer. And that has been done rather well. So it isn’t one club that is better then others it is different clubs serving purposes that they have had all along.

I think that the CFC Idea was a good one just carried out wrong and tried to be forced down on everyone. I would love to see one club that had the region level teams for u-14 and above. But the better clubs wont exist with out the other clubs producing knowledgeable players. This is because we know what the rec programs give us and that is less then desirable.

I also applaud the clubs that aren’t joining into this club bashing. So for all the lex clubs and necsa thank you.

Soccerdude – I’m honestly confused. Please help me understand.

I understood the goals of CSC and NECSA as you stated it and it makes sense; they want to be at minimum a state soccer power. Great! So we can judge them on their overall standings in the state.

As you described CRSA I understand it to be a farm and training system for the BC and Dreher players. Okay…I guess I can kind of understand that.

But what completely has me baffled is your description of the goals of the 4 clubs in Lexington. You state

>>The mission of the girls and boys club has been to service the Lexington area players that want to advance in soccer.<<

The trouble here is that this goal is so ambiguous that I can’t figure out what it means. Does this mean that Lexington clubs should be judged on the transition of Lexington recreation players to internal Lexington classic players? That makes some sense. But what of the two Lexington classic clubs? Are they judged by how many players move from Lexington to CSC/NECSA – since CSC/NECSA are the clubs that are “biggest and baddest? Of course, it could mean the Lexington players that move to GFC, St. Giles, or other “biggest and baddest” clubs as well.

Or is the Lexington goal include all of that and also include trying to be competitive at a state, regional, and national level so as to support those players capable and desirous of doing so? If so, then how does the Lexington goal differ from the CSC and NECSA goal?

I’m not trying to dismiss what you’re saying – because I think that there is something truly wonderful in the concept of clubs having goals. If each club in the Columbia area truly has a specific goal/mission that Columbia-area soccer will be much better. The trouble I have is when these soccer clubs have such ambiguous missions that no one can really tell what the mission is – and of course can’t tell if the club is succeeding or failing in its mission.

So could you please explain in more detail the Lexington mission or missions, and how we can judge the success or failure of the clubs in Lexington?

WARNING - Extremely long post

Until today I had not read these current thread's on the "One Club" issue because I got kind of burned out on this topic a couple of years ago. But I made the mistake of starting to read these posts today and spent several hours on it.

These thoughts have reminded me of a proposal I made in the form of a Powerpoint Presentation in December 2000. Maybe it's time to dust it off.

I could not find a way to attach a Powerpoint file to this message board, so I am cutting and pasting it as unformatted text.

This was a proposal for an Alliance where all the girls' clubs would work together to field premier (Challenge level) teams at each age group from the entire Columbia area while still fielding classic level (rec+) teams at the local level. Since writing it I came to believe it was too idealistic. But if enough people want this type of thing, maybe....

Take a read at this and see what you think, poke holes in it, throw it out, or use what may be helpful.

It was targeted at girls clubs, but the concept should be applicable to boys and girls. Also, note that it was written nearly 2.5 years ago and some terms are no longer accurate. For example, the Challenge League was not around yet and the choices at the time for girls was the Statewide League or the Midstate League.

Here it comes...

December, 2000

CASA: COLUMBIA AREA SOCCER ALLIANCE

Proposed as an alliance of the following pre-existing clubs (girls only):
- Chapin Soccer Association (CSA)
- Columbia Soccer Association (CSC)
- Northeast Columbia Soccer Association (NECSA)
- Lexington County Girls’ Classic Soccer Association (LCGCSA)
- Palmetto Girls’ Soccer Association (PGSA)

Purpose:
Cooperative effort to field the most competitive teams at each age group and provide the highest level of player development

Local Boards:
- Selected by each pre-existing club
- Appoint representatives to the CASA Board of Directors (2 from each local club)
- Responsible for all aspects of local organization including local Classic level and recreational teams from within the specific geographical area

CASA Board:
- Composed of 2 representatives from each local organization (CSA, CSC, NECSA, PGSA, LCGCSA)
- Officers appointed from and by these representatives: President, VP, Secretary, Treasurer, Registrar, Director of Coaching, Administrator, etc.
- Affiliate with SCYSA under a new club number
- Responsible for selecting coaches, trainers, and managers for the CASA Challenge Teams
- Responsible for coach and player development for CASA Challenge teams
- Responsible for setting fees and other fundraising for Challenge team expenses

CASA: Local Geographical Areas:
CSA – Chapin and the surrounding area
CSC – Northwest Richland County, Lexington County North of Lake Murray (exclusive of the Chapin area)
NECSA – Northeast Richland County
PGSA – South and East Richland County
LCGCSA – Lexington County South of Lake Murray

CASA Challenge Teams
- One team at each age group selected from entire CASA area
- Coaches chosen by CASA board of directors
- Play in Statewide League and competitive tournaments
- Compete for the SCYSA Challenge Cup

Local Classic teams
- One or more teams at each age group selected from girls within each local area (CSA, CSC, NECSA, PGSA, & LCGCSA)
- Coaches chosen by the local board of directors
- Play in Mid State League and in-state tournaments
- Compete for the SCYSA Classic Cup

Challenge Teams:
- Two-Fold Purpose:
1. Provide the highest level of competition and training for player development
2. Develop teams that are competitive at the regional level
- Composed of a select group of players from across the Midlands of South Carolina

Classic Teams
- Purpose: Provide classic level competition, coaching, and training for as many players as possible at an intermediate level of commitment
- Formed in each local area at each age group or combination of age groups
- Age groups should be combined when there are not enough players in a local area (i.e. U11 & U12, U13 & U14, etc)
- Local organizations should refrain from combining teams from different local areas

Player Selection:
- Tryouts will be held within each local area for each age group (U11-U19)
- Tryout dates will be staggered so the Challenge coaching staff can participate in each area
- Each age group tryout will be jointly conducted by the Challenge and local Classic coaching staffs
- Girls will be selected by the Challenge coaching staff for the Challenge team or invited to a second, centralized tryout, if necessary.
- Girls not chosen for the Challenge team will be candidates for the local Classic teams.

There are other benefits of having one club in the area but that could also be realized with inter-club cooperation such as an alliance. Examples:
- Volume buying power to get better prices for uniforms and equipment
- Corporate sponsorships of an alliance would be more attractive to companies than with separate organizations.
- Fields and other facilities could be acquired cooperatively.
- etc., etc....