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That is the best post I've read on this site. THAT IS THE ROOT OF THE PROBLEM FOR DEVELOPMENT IN THIS COUNTRY AND WHY WE WON'T CATCH THE REST OF THE WORLD!

Please, everyone, read and understand what "Purpleandyellow" just stated. It trumps any player, coach, ODP, population, whatever factor you want to argue.

It is especially refreshing, as well, that these are high school coaches saying this.

"Purpleandyellow," great post!

Beezer #70948 08/06/06 06:55 PM
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I concur with Beezer and purple. But what is the solution for America, given that our societal norms and approach to sports is so well established? I do not see how we can come even close to adopting much of the French or Italian or Netherlands concepts of youth development of the athlete. Is there room for balance and success academically and athletically such that we came become competitive internationally, or for SC regionally, in soccer. My principal thought is that the high school sports 'status' and ra-ra approach is such a part of Americana that it must remain intact. It will of course be left to the individual clubs to consider some of the tenents of foreign development, i.e., year-round training and younger focused development to attempt to raise our competitive level, whether it be in Regionals for SC or on the international scene for America.
I include these 2 articles from an AD of 33 years who is adamantly against club sports and their impact on academics.

College Sports by Charlie
Club Sports vs School Sports: (September 2004)

As club sport teams become a larger part of our national landscape, will high school athletics no longer be needed?

State legislatures have introduced bills to further the mission of club teams, coaches argue over rules against players participating concurrently on school and club teams, and many club programs have grown to overshadow the high school teams in their area.

At present, the main conflict is with soccer. Soccer activists proclaim that the sport is traditionally not tied as tightly to scholastic and collegiate levels as other “traditional” American sports. Soccer is the world game and as the sport grows and develops much like it has worldwide, it’s focused around the club level, which doesn’t have anything to do with scholastic soccer.

Club soccer advocates detest rules that apply under the educational system, such as academic eligibility and residency requirements. They want to recruit players from all over and do not care if they can or will pass any high school subject. They also want good players to play soccer year-round with them.

One underlying problem is that club programs and school programs have very different priorities. The National Federation of High School Association does not sponsor or recognize national championships in any sport. For most high school administrators, the idea of a national championship is inappropriate for the age group and should not even be a part of the high school-age culture. The elite club teams in soccer point making a “national tournament”. National championships beget corporate sponsors, heavy recruiting, and all the other unhealthy things that can happen when a sport is conducted outside the educational environment. Will we someday see a TV ad with a 14 year-old kid hawking Nike shoes?



There is an argument for going the European club model for all sports. How much public money would school districts save if they did not have athletics? Already there are fewer school staff members who coach the school teams. Non-faculty coaches have become a way of life for some schools. Club sports programs are funded by parents, but would those same parents pay the school for participation on the school team?



There are some basic philosophical differences in the school programs and the club sport model. School coaches and athletics directors promote participation. There are kids playing on school teams who will never play at the next level. The club programs want only the elite players. Without school sports, many young people would never get the opportunity to participate. In addition, education-based sports programs offer the greatest degree of accountability and evaluation of any amateur sports organization.



School sports bring communities together. What happens in football at places like Massillon, Ohio, or Odessa, Texas, cannot be duplicated by club sports. Some small communities get their identities from their local high school sports program. Club soccer will never attract 5,000+ fans cheering for a group of young men and women playing for their school. But soccer really isn’t a sport. It is a cult.



Is Soccer a Sport or a Cult? (November 2004)

There is a battle raging in America between the established interscholastic (school) sports programs and the club soccer or elite teams or travel squads as they may be called. Scholastic soccer as with all school sports must operate under a set of rules developed primarily to protect the student and the integrity of school sports. There are certain academic standards and school attendance standards that must be met by the student-athlete. There are rule limiting the number of contests a team may play. These few rules are in place to provide protection to all concerned and to insure that athletics does not disrupt the academic environment.

On the other hand, club soccer does not operate under such rules. In fact the basis of club soccer (and other non-school sports) is to have such no rules at all. Where schools are "zoned", and only students living in the school zone may participate in athletics at that school, club sports have no such zoning. This means that club, or "all-star teams" may be built from with kids from all over a city, county, state or even a region that may involve kids from several states.

Club soccer is attractive because of the prestige on the part of kids (but mainly the parents) by being a member of a "select traveling squad". Parents are willing to spend thousands of dollars and enormous amounts of time traveling to practices and out-of-town tournaments in order for their child to be on one of these teams. The whole family life may revolve around a club team. Every weekend involves a tournament, sometimes hundreds of miles from home. No one in the family has a life outside of club soccer.

Then there is the ODP or Olympic Development Program. Commitment, commitment, commitment. A professional colleague of mine has a daughter who as a high school junior was invited to an ODP tryout in a city two and one-half hours from their home. It is January and the weather is generally cold and rainy. They make the trip on a Friday afternoon after she gets out of school. Tryouts are the next day. The cost of a motel stay and meals is out of the family pocket. The next day, it is very cold and threatening snow. The ODP coaches decide it is too bad for tryouts and that they will take place the next morning. Another night in the motel and meal expenses. You got it. Called off the next day too and rescheduled for the next weekend.

Why do parents do this? Ego and the lie by club coaches that if the child makes the club team and plays year round, there will be a college scholarship waiting for them. They don't tell them there are few NCAA schools that offer even the maximum 7 1/2 full scholarships allowed per school. Most schools divide their scholarship allotment into halves and even fourths in order to sign more kids. This makes the college scholarship promise a losing financial proposition from the get-go.

Or if the family jumps through all the ODP hoops and spends the thousands of dollars associated with ODP, for the carrot of possibly making the US Olympic team. Similar to blackmail and fraud.

Club soccer is run by parents. They essentially hire the coach(es), which in most cases is one of the players parents The most popular trend though is to hire a person from a European country who played under the euro system but can't get a coaching job there. The parents run the team. That means they don't have to follow any rules that apply to scholastic sports.

The National High School Federation, the umbrella organization for state high school athletic associations, does not recognize or sanction national high school tournaments in any sport. Lots of good reasons why but mostly the expense involved, school time lost by travel, and an unhealthy educational philosophy caused by national tournaments. An opening for commercial interests to take advantage of schools, coaches and kids. Club soccer thrives on the regional and national championship concept.

Since club soccer seeks only the most elite players, it is not a developmental program as it touts itself to be. It wants the best players and the parents who can pay thousands of dollars to support it. They want to do everything they can to blackmail those kids into giving up all other school sports. One will never see an intercity kid on an elite club team. No money and no means of transportation are two of the main reasons.

Twenty or so years ago, the goal of the American soccer establishment was to someday replace interscholastic and intercollegiate football as the premier sport in the US. They dreamed of an Alabama-Auburn soccer match that would draw 80,000 fans on a Saturday afternoon. They really thought this would happen. Their goal was to go after football. One still sees bumper stickers and T-Shirts with the message "Soccer is the real football". Football (and baseball since it is played in the summer also) was the enemy. Football had it all and the soccer folks wanted it. Part of the plan was not only to promote soccer, but to tear down football.

Soccer is a great sport. It is relatively safe as compared to football or lacrosse. Size is important but agility, foot skills, and speed are more important. Uniforms and equipment are not as expensive as other sports. It has been a wonderful experience for lots of kids. It is here to stay. It will continue to grow.

Interscholastic sports keep the proper educational perspective - club soccer does not. High school associations limit the number of contests in all sports in order to keep sports in the proper educational perspective. The club soccer folks want to play 40-50 matches a year plus national tournaments, meaning a family has to give up its life for soccer. Soccer folks want to cram their sport down American throats. They have yet to convince the American media to cover club soccer as they do the more U.S. traditional sports. A sport or a cult? A sport run by cult members??
http://www.collegecharlie.com/clubsports.html

Last edited by 2004striker; 08/06/06 07:01 PM.
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Another good post.

That's why it's not pessimistic or, as some say, "communist," to say that we'll NEVER be a big time soccer country. It's realistic.

The cycle you've seen in U.S. Soccer from 1994-2006 is what you'll always see until massive changes occur. AND THERE"S REALLY NO ARGUMENT TO DISPROVE THAT. An average pro league, an occasional success with the National Team and a youth development system that doesn't develop top class soccer players.

If you want it and love it, with "it" being great soccer, get DirecTV and frequent flier miles!

Beezer #70950 08/06/06 07:24 PM
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The most telling part of this article is this:

Quote:

What makes Nazari unique, Simeone says, is that he founded his club and structured it so that he makes the ultimate decisions.

"All the other coaches operate in a system where they have to answer to boards and to parents," Simeone says. "With the Texans, Hassan is the system. Anyone who doesn't like it can go elsewhere.

"Hassan is the master of his own fate."

Which is the way a club has to be run, Nazari says.

"We have a lot of volunteers with good hearts," Nazari says. "But soccer people have to make soccer decisions. It is a huge mistake some clubs make that because the parents pay the money, they know the game.

"Standing around watching your son or daughter play the game does not make a parent a soccer person, just as standing in an operating room doesn't make someone a surgeon.

"I don't go to our parents and tell them how to run their businesses," he says. "The decisions have to be soccer decisions, not politically correct decisions."




Too often, clubs are run by parents that are interested ultimately only in their child's development and accomplishment rather than that of the team or club!

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Quote:

Since club soccer seeks only the most elite players, it is not a developmental program as it touts itself to be. It wants the best players and the parents who can pay thousands of dollars to support it.



Hurst66 #70952 08/07/06 01:35 AM
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A thought…over the last 10 to 15 years there has been tremendous growth in youth soccer in this country. There are now a lot of young adults in this country now who understand the basic principals of the game and understand what skills are required. They are getting close to marriage age. Down the road, could this result in Rec-coach dads and moms who actually have an idea of what they are doing?

I see friends who played football in high school teaching their kids the basics of blocking and tackling. Baseball and basketball parents do much the same. They send their kids into the sport equipped with the basics to compete. What kind of difference will having large numbers of parents who actually played soccer make in the next generation? Does it help eliminate the elitist tilt?


I didn't do it, but if I had you never would have known.
who_me? #70953 08/07/06 01:30 PM
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who_me?

How much are your football, basketball and baseball buddies getting paid? Are they teaching these skills for free? Anyone who is "sending their kids into the sport equipped with the basic skills to compete" in soccer nowadays....is getting a paycheck.

Do you see this changing in the future? As more soccer dads (and moms) evolve in the next generation, do you see them passing on their knowledge simply for...."for the love of the game"?


Kids play sports because they find it fun. Eliminate the fun and soon you eliminate the kid.
Hurst66 #70954 08/07/06 04:30 PM
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Hurst,
Ummmmm, I don't charge my son when I teach him and practice with him at home. I do believe that is what who was referring to.

kdlsc #70955 08/07/06 05:35 PM
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Good point kdlsc. I was reading it as if they were coaching a rec team.....and then turning them loose to a higher level.


Kids play sports because they find it fun. Eliminate the fun and soon you eliminate the kid.
Hurst66 #70956 08/07/06 07:33 PM
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This Eclipse Select Club has a year round program, which many of the girls play in instead of high school ball. Of course, two of their teams won national championships.

http://www.eclipseselect.org/year_round_program.htm

But, look at the method they employed to win that championship and all the excitement stirred up at the finals this year-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8-SyOeS3lA

http://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=206586&page=5

Last edited by 2004striker; 08/07/06 07:45 PM.
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