SC Soccer Forums SCSoccer.com Forums Club Soccer & ODP Expectation to Win!

Actually, Will, as regards report cards, I was talking about what parents (the ones who foot the bill) receive. Few coaches/programs take the time to provide "for the record" evaluations.

I would mildly disagree that games are a particularly effective evaluation tool. Performance there is subject to too many variables: things like quality of opponent, variations in playing time, performance of teammates, etc. I'd also say that no coach can see everything live. Perhaps with painstaking video breakdown and review. But not live.

I do agree that games are a critical part of development in terms of implementing technical skills in the context of tactics and learning how to compete. But when it comes to technical aspects of the game, there is no substitute for training.

Now, in Calendar Year 2010, my child "played" in approximately 60 games, which entailed several hundred hours of travel time alone. I saw development. My question would be, would I have seen MORE development with a different, more efficient, expenditure of time?

Not an indictment. Just a question.

,impl mGames

Are there not variables in training?

As for your travel ideas.....maybe you might see more burnout from constant training without any games, I dont know.

I don't have much experience with the younger age groups, but I've found that with ages 14-18, too much training without a game tends to burn them out a bit. Regularly-spaced games give relevance to what they're doing in training; they can quickly see how what they're doing in practice relates to their performance in a match. As I have yet to see a player complete ten juggles without the ball touching the ground in an actual match, I'm not sure if that's the best measuring stick to determine how well the players are preparing for competition.

It's a great question.

It strikes me that the variables in training may be minimized, or at least reduced, by a great trainer. Training situations are much more controlled and direct.

Still, I see your point about games, and their benefits. Often, they (and playing time) are the "carrot." And that's not the worst thing.

I'm coaching high school and u-10 girls soccer. In youth soccer player development Juggling ability has a direct impact on skill level. The kids who can juggle 10 times are the elite players; their first touch is better.

And the point isn't to juggle in a game. That's obvious. Juggling helps with balance, first touch, foot-eye coordination.

The question isn't about "players preparing for competition." It's about player development. Ball skills at a young age is the most important focal point. Lots of coaches spend time making 9, 10, and 11 year old kids run w/o the ball. Big mistake. Everything w/ a ball. Every drill needs a time frame or reward/consequence.

And about training: Training develops players. Games do too. Kids learn most of their ball skills in the backyard or pickup games by practicing for hours. Young kids shouldn't have to drive all over the place. Older players need to if they want to play the best competition. I played on an elite nationally ranked club team. 18 of the best 30 players in our age group in the state of South Carolina played on our club team. Since that was true, who were we supposed to play in South Carolina to get competition against players our own age? We creamed everyone.

We played up against more physically mature teams. We played a younger team of equal skill level but we beat them because we were older. We HAD to go out of state. Professional clubs travel. Mature 15-18 year old athletes must travel too.

Good points all. The key is finding the right balance between training, travel, games and fun -- with differing doses of each depending on age-group and level of competition.

To Brock: With the younger kids, I recommend a list of achievable individual skill targets for kids to shoot for, and a team web site that includes celebrating their results.

That's a really good idea! Thank you. I'll use it.

Agree totally that it's about player development. When I say, "players preparing for competition," what I mean is "developing into competitive players," not "winning games." Those are very different concepts and methods, and at that age it's not about winning and losing games.

You're right, of course, about first touch; players need to get comfortable making the ball an extension of themselves. My reaction to the "juggle test" basically came from three points.

First, "If the parent sees the kid fail right in front of their eyes, it's a reality check, for both player and parent." Personally, I never use or allow the use of the word (or concept) "fail" in connection to player development. That concept is counter to the image of the player as a work in progress.

Second, while one of the most important things a player can learn at 9, 10, 11 is to control the ball and have a great first touch, perhaps just as important is to learn to love the game and have a genuine enjoyment of being a part of it. Putting a child on the spot so that they can "fail" in front of their parents might not be the best way to foster that. Embarrassment at that age seldom does. Perhaps a friendlier and more effective approach would be to invite the parent to watch a practice and point out specific skills to look for and compare their child's mastery to that of other players.

Third, I'm not sure all parents would understand the correlation between juggling skills and development for the game. If you told me, "Elite players can juggle for ten touches; your kid can't, so he's not elite," my question would be, "OK, but what else can or can't he do compared to the other players besides stand in place and juggle?" Heck, I know older players who can stand and juggle all day but can't work the ball up the field under pressure to save their lives. It would take more than that to provide a true "reality check" unless they really understand how the skills (or lack thereof) translate into play.

I agree wholeheartedly about training and games for development...I think we're really on the same page except for that reference to "fail"!

I would never actually ask a player to do that in front of a parent. That would embarrass the player. My post was more directed towards the parents who are SO COMPETITIVE that they think winning is everything and that their kid is way better than he actually is (had to deal with that before).

Parents often lack a lot of useful knowledge about the game. If my kid played a sport, I'd get a book on it and read about it so I would sound informed.

I agree with you that "failing" is a bad word. And yes, I send out little coaching points to parents so they can understand what we're doing at practice. They enjoy learning in small segments.

Those parents are always fun...it is sometimes hard for them to see growth as a player as an end unto itself. I consider myself extremely lucky that the majority of my parents have enjoyed watching players develop and haven't judged solely on win/loss records.

I like bringing them along slowly so that they will have something other than just "handball" to yell at crucial junctures.