SC Soccer Forums SCSoccer.com Forums SCHSSCA Greenville High School

Cheers...I believe we are both coming from the same place...its just lost in my typing!!!! I disagreed with the way that I viewed things happening and I did speak directly to Russell about it and came to the defense of the players and families because you don't spend as much time together with these players/families to not feel TERRIBLE when any of them get cut. I apologize if my typing came across as negative towards your post because that was not the intent. From one parent to another (as you requested)I believe we both would react about the same way...approach Russell to get his side of the story...which I did...and then still share any displeasure I had with the situation. IMO it sounds like you may have done the same.

CABJ12...I think Russell's side of the story is more important. Did you ever talk to Russell directly about the situation?

It isn't my position to talk to him about the situation because I'm not directly involved.

>>[cabj12] Right after his U16B Premier last game in regionals this past summer in which they lost in the quarterfinals he cut about 3 kids from the team on the spot. He may have been angry and dissapointed with their play but he certainly chose a terrible time to tell them their were being cut.<<

Okay...here are several points from my understanding of the situation that have not been discussed in this thread. These are all provided from my best understanding of the situation; please note that I could be wrong about some of the details. I have tried to be as factual as I could and even point out where mistakes might have been made.

After CESA swept the 2005 state challenge cup, there was an issue with respect to tryouts and regionals. The issue was that tryouts were being held in May as per the SCYSA schedule for tryouts but regionals were in June. CESA went through the tryouts, selected teams, but as a club policy did not tell anyone who made the teams and who didn't. The coaches were told that they could inform players only after the teams were finished playing. Obviously, there were a lot of anxious players [and parents] many of whom begged CESA coaches to tell them at the earliest possible moment.

I don't know any details of the manner in which Russell Shelley informed the players and parents. I do know that his informing them wasn't driven by anger or disappointment but rather a desire to let the players know what was going on as soon as he could.

Was CESA right to force the coaches not to divulge the new teams until after regionals? I don't know. I know that they changed their policy this year and announced team rosters before regionals. I know what drove the 2005 policy -- it was a concern about players quitting teams and other players not being able to play in regionals because they didn't have enough players [note: this almost occurred in any case on some teams -- I know the U16G team that reached the quarterfinals only had 12 players able to play.] In any case, it's my understanding that players have been informed that if they quit without cause before their team has completed the season [including regionals, and hopefully nationals] that they won't be allowed to play in any capacity at CESA for at least one year. Is that better than the old policy? In my opinion, it is -- I like getting information to people as quickly as possible -- but I can tell you that I was pretty angry and disappointed when so many kids refused to go to Dallas on that U16G team and 12 kids had to perform against even greater odds than normal.

In any case, I hope this helps with some context for this discussion.

One thing for sure is that he didn't tell them because of a desire to let them know soon as possible. It also may not have been because of anger or dissapointment but who knows.

As far as the policies,I think the old one is better. The new one will force kids to go to regionals in order to be able to play next year instead of going to play hard and give a good effort. The old one lets them play at regionals knowing that they are still on the team and may drive the player to do well in order to impress the coach because I believe (not sure) that the coach could change his decision if he wanted to. It would just be easier if they had tryouts after regionals though.

hey cab, you said that you knew Russell had class, but earlier you stated that he is not "exactly a class act though". so Lance, which is it? Thats a pretty bold statement and a personal attack on someone. you should think before you type. Was it CESA policy to tell players before they left regionals? perhaps, but I dont know.

cabj12: I'm asking this question absolutely respectfully and with no hidden agenda at all: how do you know that he didn't tell them because of a desire to let them know as soon as possible? I ask because I know that on other teams the players and parents had begged to know as soon as the coach could tell them -- not because I have intimate knowledge of this team.

Regarding your opinion of the policy, I think your liking the old policy and my liking the new one underscores how difficult this issue is to resolve. It's tough trying to figure out the best way to do the best thing for the most kids in this situation. I do believe that players have responsibilities to teammates and should face consequences if they shirk those responsiblities. Who knows -- after this year there might be a third policy as the club grapples with trying to do the best thing for the most kids.

Here's a novel idea. Why not wait until everyone is back from regionals and then make the announcements. Yes, you have to wait another day or so, but 1) it's better than announcing early and having a player not be dedicated to playing in regionals or even not bothering with doing the trip, and 2) it's MUCH better than telling a player that they will not be on the team next year just after their season ended and then have to travel all the way back (from Texas)with that dissapointment.

Yes, you are going to have to tell the kid at sometime that they are cut, but why not just wait until after everyone is back from Regionals and the sting of defeat has eased somewhat. I see very little downside to this.

GVLSoccerDad, I would say you and I are the same. I am also sorry if I sounded a little defensive about what I was saying. I am Glad to hear that you talked to Shelley about everything and I am sure he told you his side of everything. I was also not a wear of the others stuff Chico has now explained. I never had the chance to play CESA ball. So of course I was in the dark about how things run. Most of my experience came from out of the country. My father was in the Air Force and that gave me the great opportunity to learn the sport over seas. The only American ball I played was at Lexington High School. I know CESA was around back then but due to other sports I was involved in I did not have the chance to play. But thank you for clearing it up. I am sure that most fathers think like us� Well the Good Father anyways. We love our kids and we want the best for them. The thing we have to remember is Coaches want the best thing for all the kids not just ours. Some times things just happen that we cannot control. I am happy to hear that what Shelley did was not out of anger. It sure did not sound like him.

>>[Cornerflag] I see very little downside to this.<<

I guess the downside I see is that if I'm a player I'd want the information as soon as I could get it [i.e., after the tryout process]. Why? Here are several reasons. The player might want the information so that they could "prove the coach wrong" at regionals. Or the player might want to make alternative arrangements. In other words, a player might say "If I can't play for CESA Premier, I'm going to play for Bridge or CUFC or whatever."

In another thread there's a discussion of club bias. In this case, I'm admitting to another kind of bias -- I think that information should be given as quickly as possible so that people have the maximum possible latitude in making their personal decisions. However, I absolutely understand that this is a tough issue and that there are other viable points of view as well.