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>>[Big Daddy] Comeon now Chico, you can do better than this.

I never said anything as fact about CASl/ CASL VA. I said I was told something.....if its not so its not so. IN any case, what is the relevance? <<

That you tend to have what appears to be a high error rate.

>>"Depends on where they move and how far they want to travel. I know of ODP kids in the upstate that play at CESA...but also that play at CFC, USA, CASC, and outside of the state in Atlanta."

Yikes...before you didn't want poor kids from Raleigh to hav ot dirve to Greensboro? I assume these CLubs exceed 50 miles?<<

Actually, they don't. How much do you actually know about South Carolina soccer? No, never mind; however, you might want to remember the old saying about the term "assume" -- it makes something out of you and me.

>>Look.....there are always good reasons for doing different, but typically a parent will choose a local option over a distant option. So a kid within 30-40 miles of Greenville will in fact likely choose CESA, his only choice.<<

Breathtakingly untrue. I know of no recreation kid that will choose to drive 30 miles from Spartanburg to Greenville. I know of no classic players that will do it. I do know of some challenge and premier players who would do it; on the other hand I know of excellent ODP players that choose to play at CFC and USA who choose not to do it.

>>"I actually want two things. First, I'd like Columbia area kids to have more choice than they have today"

What about us po folk in York County? We don't get mo stinkin choices? Right.....<<

You have at least two SCYSA soccer clubs serving a relatively small population. On a per-child basis, you have more choice than Columbia children.

>>And before you play the race card and the class card....make sure every poor minority kid in your backyard is taken care of before you try to help your reach out to Columbia

I ain't buyin it cuz. <<

It's hard not to talk about race and class when the subject under discussion is the forced dissolution of a partnership designed to go after underprivileged/at risk childen, isn't it?

Okay...and since my backyard actually is Columbia, I think that you've really accomplished something with this post...an absolutely perfectly incorrect post. Wow.

Chico,

This is about CESA, not you. I don't really care where Chico's backyard is.

And if you are talking about regional play you aren't talking about rec or classic level players. You, my man....are locked in on premier level kids. Don't kid yourself...and don't take this so personally.

futbol(soccer): I think I understand your skepticism. I think that the core of this is that you believe that the first announcement, of CESA expanding its Columbia program, is coupled to the second announcement, of the CESA/CRSA partnership. If I read you correctly, you're supposing that the CESA/CRSA partnership was in fact a subterfuge used by CESA as a mechanism for expanding its Columbia program with the primary intent of attracting more elite players (i.e., Heise/CRSA were basically unwitting dupes to the brilliant and Machiavellian schemes of CESA.) And finally, you're supposing that all of this is about elite soccer since that's what's really "important."

Here's what I have direct knowledge of. I know that within CESA the recreation, development, classic, and challenge teams are as important as the premier teams. I know that penetrating underserved markets has received more attention than elite teams. I know that in 2004-2005 that CESA dedicated itself to spending $60,000+ on financial aid for kids that couldn't afford to play -- and that the club was frustrated it couldn't afford more. I know where Hyslop and Tormey spent their MLK day as well as their other work within the Greenville community trying to increase soccer penetration. I know that these folks were willing to sponsor the North-South senior game when seniors very rarely play their next year in youth club soccer. Finally, I know that CRSA was the one Columbia club admired within CESA for its dedication to trying to reach underpriviledged markets.

I guess this is why I give them the benefit of the doubt (that and when I read the CESA/CRSA agreement there were annual grants and no guarantee of any field space or other resources, ever.)

But there's really nothing else I can say to prove this. I realize that "Big Daddy" and others see everything through the lens of the state challenge cup. I'm not going to change your minds on this...and neither is anyone else.

>>[Big Daddy] This is about CESA, not you. I don't really care where Chico's backyard is.<<

Well then you shouldn't have written "And before you play the race card and the class card....make sure every poor minority kid in your backyard is taken care of before you try to help your reach out to Columbia", should you?

In point of fact, you said I should help every poor minority kid in my backyard...and that's just what I'm trying to do. If you didn't care about where my backyard is, you shouldn't have raised it.

>>And if you are talking about regional play you aren't talking about rec or classic level players. You, my man....are locked in on premier level kids. Don't kid yourself...and don't take this so personally. <<

When you make these assertions, does it ever occur to you that you have absolutely no basis for them at all?

Big Daddy: I just went back and re-read this exchange. Everytime I raise a fact [e.g., Rock Hill actually has more choice per child than Columbia, the clubs I named are not 50 miles apart, your challenge to me to help kids in my backyard is actually what I'm doing, etc.] you ignore it and redouble the number of unfounded allegations you allege. I told you I wasn't intelligent -- it took me this long to understand.

I think the bottom line to this is...If Cesa's motive was to pull the elite players out of Columbia's clubs..then they should stay home.If the motive was to enhance soccer for everyone in the Colunbia area..then SCYSA should embrace this.The fact that they were partnering with CRSA leans me more to the assumption that the motive was to enhance soocer in the Columbia area.We get caught up with US and THEM instead of doing what's best for soccer in the state of South Carolina...Until as a state..we get by this.I do not see US moving forward as a state...I guess I need to check with the STATE first before my kids go out for the BRIDGE.Maybe our kids would bene fit more if they played soccer in uniforms that had no club names on them...


Bridge FA...No need to talk.I understand your position.It's just my opinion that MPSC and CUSC are not willing to join an alliance that leaves rec and classic players out of the fold.Why would a club want to give up part of it's membership to another club?I thought the idea is to grow and prosper.I guess the real question is Summerville going to offer Challenge teams now after the STATE's ruling

I've already spent too much time on this, as have we all. Last post on the subject...

Chico, no bad facts on my part unless you intentionally distort what I said. For example, I see you as a CESA advocate. So when I refer to your backyard i would think most people know I mean the upstate and not where Chico lives. If you want to use things like this as an example of my playing fast and loose with the facts, well what can I say.

To me it boils down to this: this was either done to help underpriveledged kids or it was done to improve CESA's competitve position regionally, i.e. attract top level players.

Helping underprivledged kids is a fabulous endeavor. But there are kids like this everywhere. Unless you can tell me with absolute certainty that 95% of the kids in the Upstate that want to play soccer but can't because of money....are already being taken care of, then I think CESA should take care of them first. Every Club has scholarship programs and 10% is a reasonable number. CESA seems to be in this ballpark and thats good, but its not as if they're doubling everyone else.

Second, if its being done for competitve reasons I understand that too and applaud CESA for pushing the edge. I would encourage their leadership to continue on and look for additional ways to achieve the same end. Partnerships, alliances....are the way to go. They got their hand slapped this time....so what? Keep pushing.

My only reason in getting into this was to say I didn't understand all the negativity toward the Columbia CLubs opposing this. I'm not anti anyone in this deal....I understand CESA, I understand why th COLA CLubs reacted as they did.

Chico, you are a passionate dude about the game. Despite our disagreements I respect that, as well as your committment to the kids. Hopefully we'll see you on the pitch someday....

Selah.

Cold&Hard,

I just don't think you will ever quite GET the concept of The Bridge FA, which is to offer more choice for players in the Charleston area (and the entire state).

The Charleston area absolutely cannot compete consistently with the best teams in the State and beyond unless they are somehow able to combine their best talents. Do you disagree with that idea?

So far, MPSC and CUSC are not willing to accept that. Now, CUSC appears to be fighting to survive, and MPSC is losing (and will be losing more) players to The Bridge each and every season that The Bridge grows and succeeds and MPSC continues its “we don’t need no stinkin’ help” attitude.

As I’ve stated before, The Bridge FA is not perfect, and they can "only do what they can do." Regarding your apparent "problem," if there are not enough challenge-level girls players willing to go out for a Bridge team in a particular age group, The Bridge is not going to be able to “make something out of nothing.”

Why would SSC now offer a challenge team? They joined the Bridge FA voluntarily. No SCYSA ruling should have anything to do with that or change their position. SSC was not forced into anything.

There is no single perfect solution that will make everyone happy, but right now, The Bridge FA concept is the best that the lowcountry has to offer.

How has CRSA become the Columbia soccer welfare poster child? Do they even has a rec. program. Are they willing to let poor kids that have never played soccer play classic and get their tails whooped. Their web site says they are a feeder program for Cardinal Newman School, which lists it's tuition at $7500.00/year. No welfare there. I personally know families that play for CRSA that go to other private schools that cost even more. In my opinion, CRSA has more of an elitist membership than any other club in the Columbia area. Where and how do they serve a needy market that other clubs don't.

Belligerent,
Cold&hard,I like that..thanks
I DO understand the concept of the bridge.I just raise points as to why everyone will not buy in to it.When I say that the Bridge is for a chosen few....It's for Challenge players!!! When you are out at the club some night pay attention to the caliber of play and practice.I would say that most clubs are eighty percent rec and classic and twenty percent or less true challenge players...again a select few..Most people that are for the Bridge,have kids that play for the Bridge or a challenge level club.They are getting the most for their dollar.If all of these players are coming from MPSC each season and I agree on that point.There are quite a bit of Mt Pleasant kids out there..but are they all true Challenge players?If they do not make a bridge team...do they stay in Summerville or go back to Mt Pleasant?Future challenge players are going to come out of some rec or classic program from somewhere.If it took forming the Bridge to get the challenge players together...then again this must be a small group.I do not have a problem with winning or higher competition.I think the Bridge concept is a good idea.I would just like to see some positive affects on the club that made it happen....SUMMERVILLE!!! Everyone wants to win but it is more important to some than others..If the concentration is on a select few then thats all you will ever have.The numbers might grow but the wins will not.The more people that are brought in to the fold...the more numbers you will have to choose from.South Carolina is only so big and it's time to start working with what we got...
As far as the Summerville statement about fielding challenge teams.I know that they will not.They should not...they have no Challenge players..Funny..The three teams that placed in state this past fall where State champions as Summerville teams also..Seems like they were doing a pretty good job before the bridge